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  1. #1
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Default Spiritual Intelligence

    I am currently reading a book on this subject although it speaks of IQ, EQ and SQ and that if -

    IQ as the intelligence that seeks to understand the 'What'.
    EQ as the intelligence that seeks to understand the 'How'.
    Then the SQ is the intelligence to understand the 'why' of things.

    Now i am only a 1/4 of the way through the book but already it has brought up some interesting questions.

    One of the questions it asks is - What do you understand is the truth of your own situation at this given time?

    By truth it mean -
    Not the voice in your head that plays the denial game.
    Not the 'make do' with my lot in life.
    Not the 'well i can justify why i am doing what is it i am doing at present'

    I suppose it asks for you to take off the gloss or rose tinted glasses and just assess the situation in an objective manner.

    Well i did this last night and scared myself .. I came to realise very quickly just how unauthentic i am being. How can i live the 'truth' when i am too busy justifying my false truths.

    Is it even possible to be completely truthful with yourself?
    Sometimes we have to do the mundane in order to reach the heights we are capable of reaching so in the process we are not being true but we are acquiring the truth in steps. Or what if we are yet to find out the truth, what if we don't know our purpose yet

    They quoted Nietzsche and i have fallen in love with it ..
    He who has a why to live for can bear almost any how.

    Any thoughts on the subject??
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  2. #2
    Minister of Propagandhi ajblaise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    I am currently reading a book on this subject although it speaks of IQ, EQ and SQ and that if -

    IQ as the intelligence that seeks to understand the 'What'.
    EQ as the intelligence that seeks to understand the 'How'.
    Then the SQ is the intelligence to understand the 'why' of things.
    They shouldn't call it Spiritual Intelligence; they should just call it wisdom. Or WQ.

    But that's just because I think secular methods answer 'why' better than religiosity. The Bible actually had some anti-wisdom and anti-philosophy passages, because it was seen as seeking objective truth outside the confines of their doctrine.

    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    They quoted Nietzsche and i have fallen in love with it ..
    He who has a why to live for can bear almost any how.

    Any thoughts on the subject??
    That's a good one. Some Nietzsche quotes I really like, that are kinda related:


    A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.


    Is man one of God's blunders? Or is God one of man's blunders?

    All credibility, all good conscience, all evidence of truth come only from the senses. (pro-sensor quote )

    Convictions are more dangerous foes of truth than lies.


    In Heaven, all the interesting people are missing.

  3. #3
    Senior Member sculpting's Avatar
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    Saslou, I spend a lot of time questioning my own motives and rational for things. Days or even weeks later I will have a problem brewing, then come to a new realization-one that may put me in a very negative light, given my actions which seemed justified at the time. I then tend to judge myself quite harshly. I cant not ignore new information, however unwanted, as I am sort of obsessed with the truth. Often though its like knowingly sticking my hand in a running garbage disposal-it hurts, but I am compelled to.

    I think it's that "why" question. Why did I respond that way? Why did I get so angry? Why did I feel so hurt? I use it on others too-why did that person respond that way? I just keep asking why about smaller and smaller chunks till I identify some core, some pattern. From the pattern I can rebuild anew and choose not to repeat the pattern again.

    I love the jungian functions as they give me a toolkit to answer some of these why questions.

    I notice the rose colored glasses much more strongly in Fe users than Te users both about themselves and their environment. I have started calling it "Fe-reality" which isnt the same as "Te-reality". The fact that you stop and question that your reality makes me admire you very much as most of my SFJ friends are very content not to look outside the shiny windows into reality.

    I had one ISFJ friend. She lives on top of a hill in a wealthy neighborhood with her perfect dog, perfect entp husband, and perfect child. She couldnt live at the bottom of the hill as that is where the "bad" people live. Those homes only cost about 300K. She couldnt "see" her husband cheats on her, couldnt "see" how she was wrong about things around her. She excluded any evidence that went against her view of what the world should be. She wants to help people-but only people who live on top of the hill. Because the other people arent real??? It's very different.

  4. #4
    Member Tycho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    Is it even possible to be completely truthful with yourself?
    Sometimes we have to do the mundane in order to reach the heights we are capable of reaching so in the process we are not being true but we are acquiring the truth in steps. Or what if we are yet to find out the truth, what if we don't know our purpose yet
    Defining "the truth about us" in terms of a spiritual meaning or purpose seems like a bad idea. Some beliefs may appeal to us more than others, we may identify some concepts that we want to live by; but we can never reach a complete understanding of them. Whenever things "feel right", more often than not we are fooling ourselves.

    From what little we really understand about ourselves, how can we expect a human being to be "authentic" at all times? What would be the merit in trying to look at yourself 'objectively'? Every attempt to translate our self-knowledge into a social identity will be counterfeit to some degree. We have to accept that.

    Why should we blame our unhapiness to the fact that we are inauthentic? Do you think that your 'authentic self' is radient with happiness and fulfillment?

    If we start analysing our 'authentic self' with a compromiseless thirst for truth, we may arrive at a point where nothing seems real anymore. That feeling of 'being inauthentic' or not true to yourself, may be a burden, a source of shame, rather than a catalyst of self-actualisation. It's an unrealistic expectation that makes you want to deny your opportunities to experience happiness here and now.

  5. #5
    Kraken down on piracy Lux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by saslou View Post
    One of the questions it asks is - What do you understand is the truth of your own situation at this given time?

    By truth it mean -
    Not the voice in your head that plays the denial game.
    Not the 'make do' with my lot in life.
    Not the 'well i can justify why i am doing what is it i am doing at present'
    This is interesting to me right now, and always really. The inner truth with oneself is something that has always been important to me. I have always tried to be as honest with myself as possible. I have always thought I was being as honest with myself as possible. I have noticed however, that as honest with myself as I feel I have been, I still have the tendency to justify and or ignore the bad in my life. Because I thought I could ignore it, for various reasons. Sometimes it can be good because a situation can be worked on if you can give it a chance.

    I have always thought that honesty with oneself is one of the most important elements of true happiness. Without owning the truth one can be content in their lies but never truly happy in their lives. It depends on what is important to the individual, because everyone is different.

    I think that is the difference between being mildly content and being happy. Some people think happiness is only a matter of perspective, that you can twist the truth in your head and make yourself happy with anything. I hope it works for them, but it does not work for me.

    Is it even possible to be completely truthful with yourself?
    Yes, it is. But it can be very uncomfortable. For me at least it involves accepting the disagreeable truths and not merely justifying the bad in life, but meeting it head on and accepting its challenge. Learning from it.

    I cannot be truly happy if I am living in a false reality, I'll bet no one really can. Sometimes the supposed comfort of the lie is much worse than the discomfort of the truth.

    They quoted Nietzsche and i have fallen in love with it ..
    He who has a why to live for can bear almost any how.
    Thank you for that, I too love it.

    Good luck, and I wish you well.
    "It is not length of life, but depth of life." ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

    "Thought breeds thought." ~ Henry David Thoreau

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    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
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    There are ways to be truthful to oneself, but yeu have to recognize yeur own inner feelings and whot they imply.

    For a current example, I'm "considering" changing one of my characters to another friends' guild on wow. There's quite a few factors to think about on the change, despite that it seems like a small and minor thing, due to it being a rather complex social situation.

    Fact is though, I can tell from my mindset already that I've probably already made up my mind on the matter and am probably going to do so regardless, and am just looking for excuses and justifications for the action at this point, and won't be comfortable making the change until I've psyched myself up mentally for it.

    So yes, I am essentially lying to myself, but I also recognize that I'm doing it at the same time. It's kind of strange that yeu still have to go through the motions regardless though.


    Regardless, the idea of IQ/EQ/SQ is kind of interesting I suppose, and am curious about getting a copy of that book. Yeu never said WHICH book though...

  7. #7
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    Im usually confused as to the exact difference between Spiritual intelligence and Existential Intelligence.

  8. #8
    mrs disregard's Avatar
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    What is so authentic about looking for a more meaningful existence? What is so loathsome about conducting a down-to-earth existence, appreciating the here-and-now? Why be spiritual for the sake of being spiritual?

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I'm familiar with some of this via logotherapy which is also associated with existentialism and N. and that quote in particular is somehing I associate with existentialism to be honest.

    The idea of spiritual intelligence and what that might mean qua the others is interesting to me but I appreciate the difference or nuance between spirituality as some understand it and existentialism.

    I'm not a fan of N. sure he has some good quotes like that one and I'm aware that some of his death of God and other things which put me off his work are more in the way of sociological observations than something he was advocating. Also some of his work I think he was mad already when he was writing it. To an extent I think he was both product and producer of a certain style of troubled narcissistic copeing style or strategy when confronted with imperfect reality and flawed, often really deeply flawed, alternatives, criticism etc. etc.

  10. #10
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tycho View Post
    ....Every attempt to translate our self-knowledge into a social identity will be counterfeit to some degree. We have to accept that.
    QFT.

    We're all really sort of fumbling our way through the dark. It doesn't mean that we can't get a grasp of ourselves, but there will always be some ambiguity.

    Why should we blame our unhapiness to the fact that we are inauthentic? Do you think that your 'authentic self' is radient with happiness and fulfillment?
    I see it ideally more as a sense of wholeness and completion, all the pieces in alignment... but that doesn't necessarily mean "happy."

    In my life, I've seen two big broad groups of "happy" -- one being feelings of overt happiness and pleasure, the other being a deep-seated satisfaction with the way things are, who I am, and feeling that "everything is aligned correctly" regardless of external circumstance.

    If we start analysing our 'authentic self' with a compromiseless thirst for truth, we may arrive at a point where nothing seems real anymore. That feeling of 'being inauthentic' or not true to yourself, may be a burden, a source of shame, rather than a catalyst of self-actualisation. It's an unrealistic expectation that makes you want to deny your opportunities to experience happiness here and now.
    It definitely can be and the danger you mention is real; but I quest for balance rather than extremity. We have to carefully navigate between the two poles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    Im usually confused as to the exact difference between Spiritual intelligence and Existential Intelligence.
    I agree, since there are various types of spiritual experience, with not all having the same priorities/criteria. Existential to me seems to be more what happens when you leach all specific religious doctrine out of a viewpoint... at that point, you are just left with very broad principles on how to approach a quest for truth in a world without definitive meaning.

    If you disagree with that last clause, then your spiritual principles and intelligence are going to differ. I can see different people defining "spiritual intelligence" differently.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I'm not a fan of N. sure he has some good quotes like that one and I'm aware that some of his death of God and other things which put me off his work are more in the way of sociological observations than something he was advocating. Also some of his work I think he was mad already when he was writing it. To an extent I think he was both product and producer of a certain style of troubled narcissistic copeing style or strategy when confronted with imperfect reality and flawed, often really deeply flawed, alternatives, criticism etc. etc.
    I think he's worth reading because he so strenuously challenged mainstream religious/life thought of the day; working to grasp his points really helps jolt one out of one's assumed framework and sets one up in the future to think more freely.

    But I do agree with a lot of your assessment here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsuni View Post
    So yes, I am essentially lying to myself, but I also recognize that I'm doing it at the same time. It's kind of strange that yeu still have to go through the motions regardless though.
    Lots of life seems to be like that -- you might be intellectually aware of what you're doing and thinking and why (to a large degree), but emotionally and realistically it takes time to accommodate and adjust to the change.

    (This is in some ways similar to that quote from the Matrix -- "You've already made the choice, what you're trying to do now is understand it.")
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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