User Tag List

123 Last

Results 1 to 10 of 65

  1. #1
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    3w4?
    Posts
    1,238

    Default Knowing that yeu know nothing

    This's regarded by some religions, and several ideologies, as the stepping stone to all else. After giving it a little thought, I think I've actually already been doing so without realizing it consciously.

    The basic idea, is that yeu know nothing; to understand or learn anything, yeu must first accept this, and understand that yeu truly do not know anything. One cannot correct a problem until the problem has been admitted to and identified.

    Now that being said, we have a starting point to work with, similar to the "I think, therefore I am" starting point. Except... we can't really PROVE we think. We may believe such, but such can also be mere illusion and assumption. I've never truly had my thought process actively work, so much as it just magically comes up with related information and makes conclusions based on the information, but there's no real 'thinking' involved, it just happens. It's quite strange when yeu stop to try to think about the actual process...

    Now that being said, we're stuck with knowing nothing. We can't even prove we exist, nor that we think. Great. So we have nothing at all.

    And therein we can use that to determine that if we don't know anything, then we have no basis to assume that we know whot isn't either; we don't know that magic doesn't exist, that god is real, or that we aren't all linked to some hive mind a la the matrix. We have no clue whot is real, which means anything is possible.

    Therefore, we can only rule based on whot seems most plausible, under the assumption that the information presented to us is accurate.

    Our senses can be deceived, our minds can hallucinate or play tricks on us, our memories are largely just key points that get 'filled in' with guesstimates as needed.

    Due to this, we really can only state whot we believe to be true, given this rather shaky foundation to work with.

    Furthermore, this acceptance of our ignorance of reality as a whole, would put us on much better grounds to deal with people. We wouldn't really have racism because we would be able to accept that we flat out don't know anything about that person; all we have are assumptions. We wouldn't need ideological wars, as we would be able to accept others' viewpoints as merely a seperate interpretation, possibly due to having different information.

    And most importantly, we'd be able to get over the concept of "knowing the truth".

    Too many times we believe we "KNOW" whot god wants. Whot the heavans demand, that there is no afterlife, that we have a purpose and a destiny, and that everyone who disagrees is wrong.

    Once we learn that we really flat out don't "KNOW" anything, maybe we can stop dealing in absolutes that only cause harm, and accept that there may be things out there beyond our understanding, and beyond our knowledge base.

    Or maybe it's just late at night, I'm bored, and felt like ranting. Whichever.

  2. #2
    Senor Membrane
    Join Date
    May 2008
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    3,190

    Default

    Yep. We know nothing, and realizing that would be solution for just about everything. But I don't think the world will be enlightened anytime soon. But that doesn't matter, I am sure that as much as you can apply this attitude to your life, the more happy you will be in the long run.

    What I would like to know is for whot reason yeu use these ugly looking word-alikes.

  3. #3
    Pumpernickel
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Posts
    1,960

    Default

    It's a dangerous thing though. Once the realization that you know nothing really sets itself into your mind, you just find yourself incapable of taking a stance on anything and really being partial to any idea as some sort of truth.

  4. #4
    Senor Membrane
    Join Date
    May 2008
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    3,190

    Default

    Well that is the point. To take you close to insanity by the paradox. The idea seems to be to learn how to live with uncertainty.

  5. #5
    Pumpernickel
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Posts
    1,960

    Default

    Why is is better to live with uncertainty?

  6. #6
    Senor Membrane
    Join Date
    May 2008
    MBTI
    INFP
    Posts
    3,190

    Default

    If you are able to live in constant uncertainty, you will be happy with what you have instead of wanting to have more. The quest for truth is usually powered by fear, so acceptance of uncertainty is courage. It is a lot easier to grasp this intellectually than live it, though... that's why we don't have many buddhas around...

  7. #7
    Pumpernickel
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Posts
    1,960

    Default

    If you are no longer wanting to have more, you'll be wanting to be wanting to have more. This living in uncertainty thing just sounds like not having any sense of self.

  8. #8
    Junior Member DMCubic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9
    Socionics
    ENFp
    Posts
    6

    Default

    JustHer: I think that to be able to live with uncertainty is incredibly liberating. It gives you a certain comfort in being where you are, because hey, you could spontaneously combust before you're done with breakfast tomorrow (or if that's too outlandish for you, you could choke on your frosted mini-wheats and be unable to Heimlich yourself before you pass out and asphyxiate). In the face of that knowledge, all your big plans for the future start to look pretty unimportant. It's not that you shouldn't go after the things you want, just that you shouldn't get ahead of yourself. That can only happen when you forget about uncertainty and imagine that your big plans have something over your mortality.

    Also, knowing nothing doesn't mean you can't take a stand, or trust in the apparent regularities of the universe. All we know of physics is inductive only, so no physical law is ever truly known. So we don't *know,* infallibly, that that brick flying at us isn't going to feel soft and squishy on impact. But we will duck anyway. Same thing with morality - so what if there are no discernible moral truths? That doesn't mean you can't set someone straight for being mean and abusive, or give generously to friends and those in need.

    In the absence of certain knowledge, we are free to reinvent ourselves. We see nothing in any aspect of our culture or upbringing that has inherent pull on us, so once we empty our teacups, we get to choose how to live our life in a completely new, much freer way.


    *update* As for having no sense of self, that's a common misunderstanding. You might know that "self" is just a constructed term lacking any real referent, but so is "clock" or "chair." And I can tell you what a clock is, and I can tell you what a chair is. It's just that our conversations about those things are not the things themselves. My "self" is as much subject to phenomenological and empirical exploration (hey, this is a typology forum, after all) as it is a total mystery, and even though I have chosen to let go of the things I used to think I knew, I still have a center of presence in the world established through the felt familiarity with my body and my relationships to things and people.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Snow Turtle's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    1,335

    Default

    Considering that eastern religions usually focus on not being attached to the ego. You'd be correct in assuming that it's about the loss of self.

  10. #10
    Pumpernickel
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTJ
    Posts
    1,960

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DMCubic View Post
    In the absence of certain knowledge, we are free to reinvent ourselves. We see nothing in any aspect of our culture or upbringing that has inherent pull on us, so once we empty our teacups, we get to choose how to live our life in a completely new, much freer way.
    You say "much freer way" like its some sort of advantage. Maybe for a P it actually is, but I find the whole too much freedom thing to be disturbingly chaotic and unpleasant.

Similar Threads

  1. I'm trying to supply my friend who knows nothing of MBTI with some material
    By swordpath in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-19-2011, 04:23 PM
  2. I want to learn poetry, but I know nothing about how to write it.
    By Alternative Solution in forum Arts & Entertainment
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 09-14-2010, 02:44 PM
  3. Does a man know too much if he realizes he knows nothing at all?
    By Iriohm in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 04-13-2010, 05:31 PM
  4. If I know nothing can I be responsible for anything?
    By coberst in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 08-12-2009, 07:09 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO