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  1. #121
    GirlAmerica
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    I am going to add something just very basic, but was very powerful in hearing it.

    What other carpenter's name do you know from over 2000 years ago?
    (...that a book was written about/based on the existance of...that has spread across the globe and important enough to spark cultures/countries in to full blown wars?)

    It really is very complicated, yet very simple.

  2. #122
    GirlAmerica
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    FYI, even accepting an absolutely biblical perspective, the idea of eternal torture is debatable. There are some (including myself) that view hell as more or less equivalent to death and not some kind of eternal torture.
    Yes...this is a good point to ponder. Even Jesus in the Garden of Gesthemane trembled in fear and fell to his knees with the understanding of being completely separated from The Father during the time leading up to his crucification.......

  3. #123
    Senior Member Dom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by targo View Post
    So I have been lost to say the least. Lost in life at the moment, there was a time when I thought that I knew where I was going and what the path before me held. A time when my faith was strong and my belief cemented. But over the course of the last year I have had some questions and some doubts and there is so much that I don't understand that I feel I should understand.

    I mean is God sadistic? I'm serious.


    I look at various quotes in the Bible.

    You did not chose me I have chosen you

    I will not give you more than you can handle

    I knew you before you were born, planned you and i know your life.

    (adlibed I know)


    As I apply these to my life I feel betrayed by God. Seriously hurt and bitter and I don't trust him. Because while I have the right to choose and I chose, I chose wrong and I failed and um God knew it too yet he still allowed for me to fail. And apparently his reasoning in this is to bring us closer to him.

    Wait back um I think in my mind, you want me closer to you so you set me up for failure and you know what I am gonna do and it's not working. This baffles me, he is supposedly my heavenly father who loves me more than anything and more than I love my children, but I wouldn't set them up to fail just so they would need me more.

    Do I set a candy bar on the coffee table and tell them not to eat it and then condemn them when they eat it, No I don't set them up to fail.

    To me this theory isn't simple it's sadistic

    Am I missing something here? Apparently my life was to set me up to need God more and it's done the opposite b/c I don't trust him at all..... yet he knew this and still he allowed it......
    Hunny, a clavainist theology does lead to god being a sadistic bastard, it's why i couldn't deal with it, the paraphrases you refer to are just that, they aren't accurate. God has a plan but i do not belive his plan involves bad for us, or didn't believe that.

    I spent a long time in a church and i was in the leadership and i did many mental cartwheels and alot of bible study and decided the calavanistic, it's all planned fatalisic view of god had to be false...

    How can i deserve death when god created me knowing i would fail?

    Sure he could know i was likely to, but for me to HAVE to fail, it had to be his design fault...

    I also decided that for me to have free will and thus be held totaly responsible for my actions (as i shoudl be) then he couldn't know what i'll choose to do...

    anyway the calvanistic aproach would suggest suffering is sent by god to temper our character and teach us how to be, this too is either wrong, or he is not a god i want to worship... did a loving god really send my stepdad cancer to teach me and my family something?

    I don't believe he did...

    Shit happens cos we live in an in perfect world, it was perfect, and god gave it to his most creative project man, we had authority over it in genisis, when we messed up it fell with us...

    shit happens cos stuff is broken... God will turn the shit to good, where we work in concert with him, but the shit is not sent by god....

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlAmerica View Post
    I am going to add something just very basic, but was very powerful in hearing it.

    What other carpenter's name do you know from over 2000 years ago?
    (...that a book was written about/based on the existance of...that has spread across the globe and important enough to spark cultures/countries in to full blown wars?)

    It really is very complicated, yet very simple.
    You're assuming he even existed.

    Historicity of Jesus @ Internet Infidels

  5. #125
    GirlAmerica
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    He did exist. There is documentation in that period of time where he was kept an eye on by the local 'law enforcement'. It is noted in more than one culture. I am going to say Roman and Greek....though I am just recalling from memory.
    They noted him at the time with others who were considered mystic types...who had a following of people claiming certain things and logs were kept of their where abouts and concerns regarding them etc.
    He did indeed exist. The context of his existance what is up for debate.

  6. #126
    GirlAmerica
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    Exploring The Passion teaching series


    I have something to add to this, however I am having an issue with it so I will have to edit it and add it later.

  7. #127
    Senior Member Roger Mexico's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlAmerica View Post
    I am going to add something just very basic, but was very powerful in hearing it.

    What other carpenter's name do you know from over 2000 years ago?
    (...that a book was written about/based on the existance of...that has spread across the globe and important enough to spark cultures/countries in to full blown wars?)

    It really is very complicated, yet very simple.
    And this proves what, exactly?

  8. #128
    GirlAmerica
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    Truly, it proves NOTHING. However, just the simple fact of it can speak volumes. There are going to be people who can and will dispell anything put down about this. There are going to be people who can take small pieces and possibly that particular fact speaks to them.

    Personally, it carried depth and meaning to me.....so I took the time to share it. Period.

  9. #129
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roger Mexico View Post
    And this proves what, exactly?
    It may not prove anything about the existence of God, but it actually does show that there is something to Christianity. It basically started as a small radical Jewish sect and now has grown into the largest religion in the world. That wouldn't happen if there was not something to it.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
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  10. #130
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    Did you just employ argumentum ad populum?

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