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INTP and hating religion.

Usehername

On a mission
Joined
May 30, 2007
Messages
3,794
everthing i am stating can be pulled directly fron the bible. ignoring it, excusising it, rationlizing it doesn't change anything.

i dont see any point
you've already admitted it's there

Robert, you seem to be unknowingly creating a strawman religion. You seem to be unaware that most of your construction of what it means to be a Christian does not fit with most Christians.

Similarly, it is unwise to ignore theories of knowledge, literature, and narrative within a religion tied to a holy book. Christians like Peguy and Scott examine these issues rationally and with both a current and historical epistemological base; you, OTOH, are not.

There are valid claims to argue against Christianity. You, unfortunately, are not engaging in many of them. You're frustrating people not because of your stance, but because you seem ignorant of the ways in which to debate against Christianity.

I suggest reading Bertrand Russell. :)
 

Robert165

New member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Robert, you seem to be unknowingly creating a strawman religion. You seem to be unaware that most of your construction of what it means to be a Christian does not fit with most Christians.

Similarly, it is unwise to ignore theories of knowledge, literature, and narrative within a religion tied to a holy book. Christians like Peguy and Scott examine these issues rationally and with both a current and historical epistemological base; you, OTOH, are not.

There are valid claims to argue against Christianity. You, unfortunately, are not engaging in many of them. You're frustrating people not because of your stance, but because you seem ignorant of the ways in which to debate against Christianity.

I suggest reading Bertrand Russell. :)
on the contrary
christians defending the bible by saying they ignore parts of it
is no real defense of anything
 

Usehername

On a mission
Joined
May 30, 2007
Messages
3,794
on the contrary
christians defending the bible by saying they ignore parts of it
is no real defense of anything

:huh: Unless, you know, you examine "theories of knowledge, literature, and narrative" from either an atheistic or a theistic viewpoint. You're getting attitude back because you're arrogantly asserting a position that you have shown yourself ignorant toward.
 

Robert165

New member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
I was so looking forward to enlightenment too. :(
no, you weren't

Hell is just in no way a prominent theme in the Bible and doesn't show up very much, and where it is there it's hardly clear what exactly it is. You're making assertions of its presence in the Bible, but seem to be relying almost exclusively on certain streams of tradition which go well beyond what's stated in the Bible in your understanding of hell.

see, you know the bible talks about hell, you just want to pretend like it doens't matter.
 
S

Sniffles

Guest
Yes Robert, God created Hell just to give you something to rant and rave about. There happy?
 

Scott

New member
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
97
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9/5?
no, you weren't

Hell is just in no way a prominent theme in the Bible and doesn't show up very much, and where it is there it's hardly clear what exactly it is. You're making assertions of its presence in the Bible, but seem to be relying almost exclusively on certain streams of tradition which go well beyond what's stated in the Bible in your understanding of hell.

see, you know the bible talks about hell, you just want to pretend like it doens't matter.

No, I know the Bible occasionally talks about hell, I'm just not quite certain that what it's talking about is anything like what you mean, or is even necessarily a literal place. I'm also pretty confident that it was never a central part of the theology of the new testament writers (it doesn't even get a mention in the majority of the books). Not that I've necessarily even got a problem if it is literal, eternal punishment; it just seems absurd for you to assert that's what it is, and for you to take a view of the Bible that isn't representative of huge swaths of Christians, who don't necessarily see the Bible as the one Christian authority, or who at least think that Biblical interpretation is a bit more involved than you make it out to be.

It's also a bit frustrating that you're asserting a view of hell that isn't necessarily what the Bible means when it talks about hell, and then claim that you're the only one here taking the Bible or Christian thought seriously.
 

Robert165

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Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Yes Robert, God created Hell just to give you something to rant and rave about. There happy?
how am i possibly supposed to comment on that? you're mad at me and all i've done is point out the problems in your religion. your only defense is by ignoring my criticisms. this makes you look even worse.
 
S

Sniffles

Guest
how am i possibly supposed to comment on that? you're mad at me and all i've done is point out the problems in your religion. your only defense is by ignoring my criticisms. this makes you look even worse.

Yes Robert, your arguments completely blew me away. Your superior intellect is just without any equal in the universe. How could I've possibly been so foolish to challenge you, what the fuck was I thinking?
 

Robert165

New member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
Yes Robert, your arguments completely blew me away. Your superior intellect is just without any equal in the universe. How could I've possibly been so foolish to challenge you, what the fuck was I thinking?
Ah, but see, you haven't given an opinon on wether or not it's fair to send people who don't think like you to hell, to suffer, for all eternity. In fact, you've been remarkably silent on the topic.
 

Robert165

New member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
No, I know the Bible occasionally talks about hell, I'm just not quite certain that what it's talking about is anything like what you mean, or is even necessarily a literal place. I'm also pretty confident that it was never a central part of the theology of the new testament writers (it doesn't even get a mention in the majority of the books). Not that I've necessarily even got a problem if it is literal, eternal punishment; it just seems absurd for you to assert that's what it is, and for you to take a view of the Bible that isn't representative of huge swaths of Christians, who don't necessarily see the Bible as the one Christian authority, or who at least think that Biblical interpretation is a bit more involved than you make it out to be.

It's also a bit frustrating that you're asserting a view of hell that isn't necessarily what the Bible means when it talks about hell, and then claim that you're the only one here taking the Bible or Christian thought seriously.
well if you've got no problem with it, if it "were" a literal place, then we have nothing more to discuss than me saying you're a pretty sad, disturbed person.
 

Scott

New member
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
97
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9/5?
Ah, but see, you haven't given an opinon on wether or not it's fair to send people who don't think like you to hell, to suffer, for all eternity. In fact, you've been remarkably silent on the topic.

You seem to be under the impression that you've come at this conversation in a way worth taking seriously or open to sincere dialogue. This is not the case. Were it the case that you'd been open to sincere conversation in the first place you would have gotten more in return. As it is, we've done what we can.
 

Robert165

New member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
257
MBTI Type
ENFJ
You seem to be under the impression that you've come at this conversation in a way worth taking seriously or open to sincere dialogue. This is not the case. Were it the case that you'd been open to sincere conversation in the first place you would have gotten more in return. As it is, we've done what we can.
oh, thats rich, the guy who thinks i deserve to go to hell and suffer forever because i dont think like him, criticizes me for being insencere and not being open to dialouge......
 

Scott

New member
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
97
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9/5?
oh, thats rich, the guy who thinks i deserve to go to hell and suffer forever because i dont think like him, criticizes me for being insencere and not being open to dialouge......

I do? I'm pretty sure I don't. I don't even think I know anyone who does.
 

Scott

New member
Joined
Nov 1, 2008
Messages
97
MBTI Type
INTP
Enneagram
9/5?
really?
Not that I've necessarily even got a problem if it is literal, eternal punishment

For one, there's an important "if" in there. For another, if such a hell exists, people don't wind up there for disagreeing with me. Anyway, I think I'm going to take a break from this thread for a bit, in spite of all the good it seems to be doing.
 
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