User Tag List

First 678910 Last

Results 71 to 80 of 100

  1. #71
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    5,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    But, if there is absolute truth than some interpretations will be closer to the truth than others. The only exception might be the portions of the Bible that are pure poetry. But even in the poetry I believe God is trying to communicate certain determinable messages.
    Yes, and I'm sure whatever interpretation you choose for them makes you happy...and thus religion has served its purpose.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  2. #72
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,805

    Default

    Uh, no my religious beliefs do not make me happy in and of themselves. At least not all of them. I take no joy in the belief that God will send people, people I love and care about, to hell. I don't believe things like that because they make me happy I believe them because I'm compelled to believe what the bible teaches. I am compelled to believe what I believe is reasonable and coherent (of course I also think my belief is supernaturally compelled by the work of God). If you accept certain presuppositions about Christianity than it becomes amazingly self-consistent and reasonable.

  3. #73
    Senior Member swordpath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    MBTI
    ISTx
    Posts
    10,552

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    You said I was wrong according to the Bible's teachings. It seems quoting the bible would be helpful in determining what the bible's teachings are.
    It doesn't say we will get what we want, because there's stipulations involved.

  4. #74
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,805

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beat View Post
    It doesn't say we will get what we want, because there's stipulations involved.
    I'm sorry, I don't really understand what you are saying. Can you flesh that out for me?

  5. #75
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    5,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    If you accept certain presuppositions about Christianity than it becomes amazingly self-consistent and reasonable.
    If you accept certain presuppositions about anything, it becomes consistent and reasonable. What's your point?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  6. #76
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,536

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    If you accept certain presuppositions about anything, it becomes consistent and reasonable.
    This is completely true.

  7. #77
    Senior Member Into It's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Posts
    664

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    OP:

    Your question rests on the false presumption that there is such thing as "innocent suffering."

    Christians believe "ALL have sinned and have come short of the glory of God."


    IF God is Just and IF ALL have sinned and deserve just punishment than punishment is all God owes to Anyone.

    The amazing thing about the Christian God is that he did intervene and is intervening to take away sin and make people whole through his saving grace by the work of his son Jesus.

    And even to those that are not Christians God is still merciful to them through his common grace and he withholds the full force of his wrath. He enables all people to enjoy creation and all the benefits of being human when we do not deserve it.


    The real question is: Why do good things happen to bad people?
    We're supposed to praise God when he *doesn't* hurt us, for that very reason, and call him merciful?

    I don't think I owe God with my behavior because he's the all powerful rulemaker any more than I believe that you have the right to tell me what to do just because you're holding a gun.
    What's the difference? It's tyranny.

    You can't possibly put "God is just" and "We are all guilty" in the same post. As Ayn Rayn said, "To be found guilty in a matter where no innocence exists is a mockery of justice" ...as well as..."A free will saddled with a tendency is like a game with loaded dice."

    I'm created with a propensity for evil for which I will be punished. I'm created with a free will and then told not to use it!

    (Same goes for my reason)
    An inscription above the gate to Hell:
    "Eternal Love also created me"

  8. #78
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    5,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Into It View Post
    We're supposed to praise God when he *doesn't* hurt us, for that very reason, and call him merciful?

    I don't think I owe God with my behavior because he's the all powerful rulemaker any more than I believe that you have the right to tell me what to do just because you're holding a gun.
    What's the difference? It's tyranny.

    You can't possibly put "God is just" and "We are all guilty" in the same post. As Ayn Rayn said, "To be found guilty in a matter where no innocence exists is a mockery of justice" ...as well as..."A free will saddled with a tendency is like a game with loaded dice."

    I'm created with a propensity for evil for which I will be punished. I'm created with a free will and then told not to use it!

    (Same goes for my reason)
    No dude, just have more faith and it'll all make sense. Just try to not think about the parts that blatantly don't make sense.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  9. #79
    Senior Member Into It's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Posts
    664

    Default

    One more note on Hell - to which I am sure to go.

    Yahweh is THE most evil figure imaginable. Satan doesn't even hold a candle to him.

    There is not a single human being who deserves Hell. There never was, and there never will be.

    Hitler doesn't deserve anything CLOSE to Hell. The worst thing that Hitler deserves is to suffer every bit of torment he caused. He deserves to feel every pang of loss and to relive every painful death he has caused. Let's say he deserves to feel all of that suffering, start to finish, fifty trillion times.

    That wouldn't even be the first *second* in hell. Not the first *picosecond* by definition. And this is where we are all destined to go, unless we follow a set of tyrannical rules which *include* compulsory love for the one who is sending you there. How anyone could worship God out of pure fear I can understand, but to worship him AND think that he is not evil? How? What's so good about him? That he blessed us with life? If we could really fathom the pain of eternal torment, and We were in limbo, and God asked us, "Do you want to live 80 years on Planet Earth which will be half pleasurable and half painful? Keep in mind, there is a very real chance that you will wind up in eternal torment for all eternity for what appear to you to be relatively minor transgressions." Anyone would say "No, please, don't put me there, it isn't worth the risk, I'd rather just not be born." I don't OWE him for this "gift of life" that I didn't ask for and WOULDN'T have asked for (if heaven and hell existed).
    An inscription above the gate to Hell:
    "Eternal Love also created me"

  10. #80
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    7w6 sx/so
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    5,554

    Default

    Infinite punishment for finite sin never really made sense to me, either.

    My favorite defense they'll use when you point out inconsistencies: "I don't make the rules; that's just how it is!", as if they're unable to pick up on the fact that my criticisms of the inconsistencies suggest that the entire system is nonsense. I'm not accepting that it's true and just complaining that it's unfair; I'm pointing out how the entire philosophy is internally inconsistent and that the entire concept of Hell is probably made up.

    Of course, consistency isn't the point. It's not supposed to make logical sense, because that would defeat the purpose of faith.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

Similar Threads

  1. The Nature of Ne -- a metaphorical visual
    By spirilis in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 54
    Last Post: 03-20-2009, 01:55 AM
  2. The Nature of Values
    By Kiddo in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 06-22-2008, 02:42 PM
  3. The Nature of Fi -- a metaphorical visual
    By arcticangel02 in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-13-2008, 07:12 PM
  4. The nature of certainty...
    By Kiddo in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 48
    Last Post: 02-24-2008, 08:58 PM
  5. The Nature of Generosity
    By Mycroft in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 52
    Last Post: 10-08-2007, 05:53 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO