I've skimmed Jen's post which seems to cover a lot of this....
Can you make this clear, please?
some of it, but someone of it there is no clear answer...
Is our character influenced by the real, material, planets?
OK astrology is the interpretation of the planets and where were at the moment of our birth for the location we are born at.... now Jen's post
The ones made out of stone and gas and revolving around the sun?
Yes - astrology interprets astonomical data... it applies centuries old means to the different planets etc....
Is it influenced by how our earth revolves around the sun?
Planetary movment around the ecliptic, so it is earth centric... it's about the person (and not the sun).....
If then, why are you not incorporating the real, material, properties of those planets? First there is the sun, much bigger than the rest, so big actually everything else revolves around it.
Because it's astrology not astronomy... It's interpretative... actually slower moving planets typically have more power than faster moving planets... the moon is the quickest, and it impacts emotions, Pluto the slowest, and that is more about the fabric of your being. Slow planets give of more concentrated energy if you like (even thought they are very far away - it's like get the concentrated version of the personal planets). Personal Planets are the Sun, moon, merc, venus and mars
If you count ten, does that include Pluto as well? Why not all the other debris that's as big as Pluto?
Astrologers still in the main recognise Pluto, traditional astrologers (thems that use really ancient astrology) never recognised it in the first place (they also don't use uranus or Neptune), modern astorlogers still use it because they can see the impact... I use it personally
As for other debris... many astrologers use fixed planets and astraids, I find them a bit lame, I occationally use a few but not a big fan personally
Or is astrology a method to describe characters that has nothing to do with the real material planets? Is everything symbolic?
Kind of, they are a picture of your resources...how you choose to use those resources is your own affair... but if you don't have XYZ ability you can develop it to a minor extent but it will be hard work the whole way
If then, why are you basing your conclusion on a real birth date which is determined by the place of our earth at the moment of birth?
Like Entropie - you have the ENTP signature, Uranus Chiron, Moon aspected Chiron
You are a big Cancer (venus, Sun and mercury) and relationships person, very nurturing very mothering, very caring... a bit of a mother hen. Supposedly likely to be good at cooking, but I meet more Cancer women who like to eat more than they like to cook... but the big word for this sign is to Nurture. When at home you are likely to be constantly pottering around doing something.
You have 7 planets on the right hand side of your chart, making you a bit fatalistic, and probably a bit less driven.
Sometime you comunicate to forcefully, and can be a bit domiant probably when you are on a soap box. I'd guess you are not likely not to suffer fools gladly.
Ah you have a LOVELY saggie mooon, oober optimistic, and warm.... people like to be married to women with saggie moons, theya re nice to be around.
URanus - the planet of creativity is makign a difficutl aspect from Saturn, the planet of tradition... it's likely that at some points in your life you have had to contrain your eccentricities. You want to express yourself but situations happen where you ahve to be squarer than you want to be.
Ah Venus Sexitle Jupiter, two of the best doing nice things to you...often associated with material comfort, the sextiles are weaker aspects so likely to be comfortable than oooooer rich.
Thanks for the explanation, Tinkerbell. But it still seems a whole lot of magical reasoning to me.
Magical reasoning = links made by similarities rather than statistics. Do you have *statistical* evidence?
It's a task for any scientist to reject false connections, even if they are part of a thousand year old traditional knowledge. "Old" does not make something true. I'm totally willing to accept the astrology connection, but only if it has been proven experimentally. Until now, I've only seen statistical experiments which disprove it. I will change my mind if given evidence, but not earlier.
We can try to create statistical evidence, if you want. Take a easily testable these. Eg. "Persons who are born during the day, when the Sun was in sight, are more likely to be judging." I don't know if this is true, but it can be tested in a statistical way.
Take a lot of persons. Check when they were born. Check if they are judging. See if there is a correlation. If eg. 70% of the Js were born during the day, you can accept the these. If it's more like 50%, you've got to reject it. (If it's only 10%, you can of course accept the antithese "persons born during the day are more likely to be P").
Got questions? Ask an ENTP!
I'm female. I just can't draw women
i'm not trying to prove anything. MBTI hasn't been statistically proven according to google.
astrology does have some researh supporting (particularly gaucolain ?sp) it but just as much againt. trouble is people and astrology are both complex,like psycology are difficult to prove.
much has been written on behaviourl theory... a fair bit is guff and more still unproven.
right now its difficult to measure... but it wont be like that always
PS most astrologers are likely to trya nd test purist astrology instead of testing broader trends and seeign if they stand up to validation... I find the test the fragments of people almost certianly prone to falling over in testing... It's pretty similar to testing psycologiy, there are so many factors at play...makes it hard to test the humaness of the situation
I should catch up and answer some of the post inbetween I've not finished...
EnF... I'll have a quick look.....
Mars in the 12th house... spiritual pursuits/understnaidng yoruself and the worldngs of the mind and the unknown, psycology and psyciatry would be of interests as would occult and deeper mean of life subjects.
Mars in here can also mean clandestine relationships. Also it can mean not understanding your anger and you may find you explode at times without reasons because something weeks previously pissed you off.
Saturn in the first house adds a maturity to your projection of personality, grown up before your time, seen as responcible, bossible a bit stoic. Saturn is unaspected, likely you will make a living at some point in avery unusal way... One person I know with this is a psycic healter, another a childrens entertainer and balloon man, street performer... basically you have a lot of ways you can make a living to support yourself.
Pluto is the first house indicates you are a powerful force in your own right, it's opposing your Sun indicating you may have issues around beign overly dominant with people, and or swamped by them... it may be you are domiant because you feel submerged... the computer says abot this "You feel that the world is opposing your deepest wishes and become explosive in response. Your life undergoes change and you react. As a child you may have been a victim of a powerful parent figure. Your challenge is to be powerful in the most positive sense of the word."
You need to learn to deal with that aspect in your life, and that is likely to take some degree of work
Jupiter in your first house/near the second... Jupiter can indicate expantion, I think financially you will be very comfortable (or a total spend thrift)... more likely the former I'd hope... You will be lucky wiht money - something about this impacts your personality and possibly makes you a bit flashy.
7th house Sun - you die if you don't ahve a relationship on the go, you would stuggle big time to be single, because you learn about yourself through relating to people.
Venus and moon in the 6th house - Venus is seduction and femaleness, Moon is nurturing motherliness and that type of thing, both are in the 6th house of small pets, staff, health and in the sign of Pisces - Ahhhhh how sweet, the most empathietic of sign. I suspect you care for a living or have had women in your life that are unwell, possibly in a chronic way. You are at your most beautiful when you are caring about other people in your day to day working regimes.
Taurus Sun means you like resources in a tangible material ways. Taurus likes heir creture comforts, so you ar elikely to enjoy a bit of decadent indulgence...