User Tag List

First 9101112132161 Last

Results 101 to 110 of 643

  1. #101
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Posts
    3,187

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    And Risen, I frankly don't even understand what your post is trying to say.
    Exactly.

  2. #102
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4
    Posts
    4,010

    Default

    Ain't that America..
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

  3. #103
    Listening Oaky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/so
    Socionics
    SLI None
    Posts
    6,168

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    Killing human life is not wrong if it's done for a reason. For example, self defense.
    GOOD Reason

  4. #104
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    MBTI
    INTj
    Posts
    1,650

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    You fail to understand that any society cannot exist unless there's a common practical belief in certain truths.
    But it doesn't follow that we must agree on everything in order to coexist.

  5. #105
    Senior Member Grayscale's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    MBTI
    istp
    Posts
    1,962

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    Killing human life is not wrong if it's done for a reason. For example, self defense.
    Agreed... but who needs defending here? Why is the fetus/embryo/big-clump-o-human-cells being destroyed because of a decision that the mother made? You could say, a child exists because their mother gave birth to them, but I think we can all agree that would not give the mother the right to kill the child if it was an inconvenience.

    Even our judicial system makes distinctions in accountability, adults are tried differently than juveniles and children because they do not know better. Well, who is the one who ought to know better here? Which one is suffering a loss at the mistake of someone else, and which is shirking responsibility for their choices?

  6. #106
    Permabanned
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    9w8
    Posts
    3,187

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Not_Me View Post
    But it doesn't follow that we must agree on everything in order to coexist.
    It is the manner of your "coexistence" that is determined by what is agreed upon, or not agreed upon. It is that order that creates the world we live in.

  7. #107
    Sniffles
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    Well we are divided as a society already when it comes to certain beliefs.
    True, but I never said we should agree on exactly everything for the exact same reasons. However, that doesn't mean it's a free for all in regards to certain values society should uphold in common. Again how can you have a democracy without common belief in freedom, justice, and law?

    The abortion issue will NEVER be objectively and unshakeably true, because it's based on opinion.
    Based on your opinion.


    As I've been saying, the most rational decision is for people to be able to have their opinions and live freely.
    Subjectivism is not rational. Reason actually determines that there is a common truth to all men, even if it may apply differently in specific circumstances.

    This is why we have a freedom of religion and political belief.
    Read again my references to Tocqueville's remarks on this issue.

    This is also why we should have a freedom to believe whether abortion is "right" or not, and for the people who think it's "right" to be able to get them and for those who think it's not "right" to be able to choose to not get one. Simple as that.
    In other words, bracket controversial issues for the sake of political and social cooperation. However, there are several problems with this approach, which in the end results in attempts to avoid the issue rather than resolving it - which would require a substantial view about conceptions of the human person in regards to moral, religious, and socio-political contexts.

    Without that, you cannot assert anything about "civil rights" or anything of the sort, because you no foundation from which to assert that humans have any such rights at all.

    I'll remind that Martin Luther King Jr. was a Personalist, which asserts the dignity of human personality and life - and it was on that philosophical basis he made his case for Civil Rights. Do I have to get into the importance of religious and moral arguments in that case as well?

  8. #108
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    MBTI
    INFJ
    Enneagram
    4w5
    Posts
    8,828

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Grayscale View Post
    Agreed... but who needs defending here? Why is the fetus/embryo/big-clump-o-human-cells being destroyed because of a decision that the mother made? You could say, a child exists because their mother gave birth to them, but I think we can all agree that would not give the mother the right to kill the child if it was an inconvenience.

    Even our judicial system makes distinctions in accountability, adults are tried differently than juveniles and children because they do not know better. Well, who is the one who ought to know better here? Which one is suffering a loss at the mistake of someone else, and which is shirking responsibility for their choices?
    I think you might be oversimplifying a bit. You can't reduce this problem to "irresponsibility." There are a lot of factors at work here.

    First, why is it necessary that all human life has the same value and the same rights? Couldn't human beings in one stage be accorded different rights than those in another? Does a person have a right to have a limb amputated, or is that wrong because the limb contains "human life" in the form of cells?

    Second, why is the death seen as a "loss"? A loss of what, they haven't lived a life or had any meaningful experiences yet.

    Lastly, why is it a matter of refusing accountability? It seems to me that getting an abortion might be some people's way of taking accountability, saying that they feel it's the best decision for everyone involved. Sex is an action that has consequences, and abotion is also an action with consequences.

    Who are you to say that a person is allowed to take one action and accept that set of consequences, but not to choose the other action and accept the consequences? Why should a person not be allowed to take an action that modifies the consequences of a previous action? It's not true that abortion has no consequences... it does. They're just different from the consequences of NOT having one.

  9. #109
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ESFP
    Enneagram
    9w8 sx/sp
    Socionics
    SEE Fi
    Posts
    7,004

    Default

    Hmm...

    Well I'm tired of this. Cya. You didn't shoot me down, we just have totally different ways of viewing this issue. Neither is good nor bad. And nothing is going to be changed when two arguers are both stubborn with their beliefs. This debate will be endless.

    So whatever.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  10. #110
    Sniffles
    Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    First, why is it necessary that all human life has the same value and the same rights? Couldn't human beings in one stage be accorded different rights than those in another? Does a person have a right to have a limb amputated, or is that wrong because the limb contains "human life" in the form of cells?
    Well it's required if you wish to have a state based upon concepts of justice - which includes the defense of life on an objective basis. Otherwise you end up with regimes like the Nuremberg Laws, where accidental(subjective) elements become the main factor in determining your life's value. Lebensunwerten Lebens was the term used to justify this - "lives unworthy of life".

Similar Threads

  1. For those who believe in spirit/soul...
    By Little Linguist in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 08-16-2008, 09:17 AM
  2. For those who like Japanese animes...
    By Seether in forum General Psychology
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 06-12-2008, 05:09 PM
  3. For those with high cuteness thresholds...
    By anii in forum The Fluff Zone
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 12-23-2007, 09:47 PM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 10-10-2007, 10:56 PM
  5. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-28-2007, 01:32 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO