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  1. #81
    78% me Eruca's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Your last line doesn't even make sense.

    I never said atheists aren't moral. In fact, I stated the exact opposite. I believe atheists are more often than not moral individuals (when using the colloquial definition of today's age).

    I asserted that the linguistic definition originated from the church to refer to something purely theological. Read closer.
    So just to clarify, do you believe theists are any more moral than atheists on average?
    I hope I'm wrong, but I believe that he is a fraud, and I think despite all of his rhetoric about being a champion of the working class, it will turn out to be hollow -- Bernie Sanders on Trump

  2. #82
    Writing... Tamske's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    I friggin hate this bullshit assertion - "If you don't believe in God then you have nothing to base your morals on".

    So personal ethos are insufficient to make a decent human being?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragingkatsuki View Post
    ^ and where do personal ethos come from?
    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    My precious mind.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragingkatsuki View Post
    ^ Aah yes. But how did it get in there?
    Evolved.

    And now that I figured out that multi-quote to make my previous post understandable, I'm going to try to delete that previous post, replacing it with this one...
    Edit: succeeded.

  3. #83
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nancynobullets View Post
    So just to clarify, do you believe theists are any more moral than atheists on average?
    ^ not directed at me, but: I don't believe that that theists are any more moral, in fact, I've found that theists of the local variety(primarily protestant christian) tend to be much more immoral. (Moral in the commonly used sense of the word[colloquial]) More likely to be racist(regardless of race), more likely to have casual sex(jesus doesn't care what you do as long as you accept him as your personal saviour or savior and you're not doing people of your own sex and you don't have abortions or kill old ladies), more likely to disregard the teachings of the new or old testaments, more likely to get into fist fights about who's god is better, more likely to segregate themselves from undesirables(in complete contradiction to life and teachings of hey zeus), etc, etc.....

    btw, the most immoral groups I've experienced are wiccans, thelemites and jews.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  4. #84
    Senior Member BlueinGreen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    I friggin hate this bullshit assertion - "If you don't believe in God then you have nothing to base your morals on".

    So personal ethos are insufficient to make a decent human being? One must believe in God, specifically fear God and God's damnation in order to be a decent human being, and not a berserk baby eater?

    What would modern Christianity be without a fear of hell anyway? I'm guessing churches' tithing income wouldn't be nearly as high.
    It's funny, because it means that Christians must not believe in the intrinsic moral value of not roasting children over a fire. If find it utterly ridiculous.

    A relevant quote:

    "A person's ethical behavior should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. People would indeed be in a poor way if they had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death."
    - Albert Einstein

  5. #85
    no clinkz 'til brooklyn Nocapszy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragingkatsuki View Post
    ^ I know you know that I'm steering away from the original argument. I just want to get to the roots of where personal ethos come from. Surely it wouldn't pop up in your mind from out of nowhere.
    why not?
    the idea of god had to pop into someone's head [seemingly] from nowhere.

    a prophet has no explanation for his visions, he just knows what he experienced.

    how is that any different from developing a personal value system?



    the truth is that it doesn't matter where it comes from, as long as it's there.
    it's good to see someone researching a method alternative to god's irrational creed, one way or another.
    we fukin won boys

  6. #86
    Senior Member Yloh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajblaise View Post
    Yeah, eating babies is wrong. Unless God tells you to...

    And ye shall eat the flesh of your sons, and the flesh of your daughters shall ye eat (Leviticus 26:29).
    And toward her young one that cometh out from between her feet, and toward her children which she shall bear: for she shall eat them (Deuteronomy 28:57).
    And I will cause them to eat the flesh of their sons and the flesh of their daughters, and they shall eat every one the flesh of his friend (Jeremiah 19:9).
    Ummm, I know where you are going at with this, but that is NOT what those verses are saying. I hate it when people get a scripture and bring it WAY out of context. :steam: Both Christians and Atheist are guilty of this. Please, read the whole section and understand what is truly going on before you use a verse to make a point.

    Read

    Leviticus 26: 14-39 Conditions and Results of Disobedience

    Deuteronomy 28: 15-68 Promised Curses for Disobedience

    Jeremiah 19: 1-15 Sigh of the Broken Flask


    Quote Originally Posted by BerberElla View Post


    I like mine slow cooked over an open a fire. How do you like yours?
    Anyways, I don't think this baby example is a good way to explain why Atheist are the way they are. I also don't think this thread was meant to be taken seriously , but it this is a serious topic.

    People are justifiable creatures. We have to justify what we do, so we can do what we do with confidence. Atheists have a reason why they are Atheists and Christians have a reason why they are Christians. Muslims have a reason why they are Muslims and Buddhists have a reason why they are Buddhists. You get the point, so I'll stop.

  7. #87
    (☞゚∀゚)☞ The Decline's Avatar
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    I must say, the idea that morals can only be sourced from the idea of god from an ancient text is quite laughable. This doesn't discourage my own effort to conjure a personal idea of god for my own use, I just don't think that it has anything to do with morals or values. Such things are of my own invention because, very simply, I believe certain things to be "wrong", most often relying on the idea that such things lead to destruction of order.

    Oh my, am I confusing those who wish to draw lines between believers and atheists? Hopefully so.
    "Stop it, you fuck. Give him some butter."
    Ti
    = Ne > Ni > Fi > Te > Se > Fe > Si INTP (I/PNT) 5w4

  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Decline View Post
    I must say, the idea that morals can only be sourced from the idea of god from an ancient text is quite laughable. This doesn't discourage my own effort to conjure a personal idea of god for my own use, I just don't think that it has anything to do with morals or values. Such things are of my own invention because, very simply, I believe certain things to be "wrong", most often relying on the idea that such things lead to destruction of order.

    Oh my, am I confusing those who wish to draw lines between believers and atheists? Hopefully so.
    Fuh fuh fuh.

  9. #89
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nancynobullets View Post
    So just to clarify, do you believe theists are any more moral than atheists on average?
    If moral is only something to do with the church, then atheists and morals are completely bifurcating ideas, i.e. atheists couldn't be anything but amoral (note: the prefix "a" means "without"; it is not, in any way, a judge on someone's morality "level").

    If moral is a judge of character, then yes, many religious people have terrible morals, and many atheists have upstanding morals.

    It depends on the definition! That's all I was trying to say, lol.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  10. #90
    . Blank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yloh View Post
    Ummm, I know where you are going at with this, but that is NOT what those verses are saying. I hate it when people get a scripture and bring it WAY out of context. :steam: Both Christians and Atheist are guilty of this. Please, read the whole section and understand what is truly going on before you use a verse to make a point.
    Yeah, without an interpretation by your side on what's "actually" being said in those full quotes, you can't even say that those quotes were used incorrectly--you're just saying they aren't correct with no validation.
    Ti = 19 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Te = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ne = 16[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fi = 15 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Si = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Ni = 12 [][][][][][][][][][][][]
    Se = 11[][][][][][][][][][][]
    Fe = 0

    -----------------
    Tiger got to hunt, bird got to fly;
    Man got to sit and wonder why, why, why;
    Tiger got to sleep, bird got to land;
    Man got to tell himself he understand

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