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  1. #311
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    Christians worship the Trinity, Muslims worship Allah, but I have never heard a pantheist say they worship Pan. Why is that?
    Pan in Greek meant "all." Pan the was the god of nature, and nature kind of by its definition is all (in a broad sense). A pantheist believes that all is god, and god is all- or more generally that god and nature are the same.

    You see dear Mole, sometimes there actually is an answer to your questions.

  2. #312
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    Bread. Bread is delicious. I worship bread.

    I don't think there's some spiritual truth we can really take away from that, as it happens. I just think that there's an underlying order, but I don't get "proof" that we should love everyone or something from it. It doesn't tell me much about morality, or that a better world is possible, or any of that.
    I don't know what you mean by your reply.

    But is seems to me that the refusal of Pantheists to say they worship the God Pan is an act of bad faith.

  3. #313
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    I don't know what you mean by your reply.

    But is seems to me that the refusal of Pantheists to say they worship the God Pan is an act of bad faith.
    That's not what the term means. If this is somehow about Julia Gillard losing the election, I'm sorry, but I wasn't responsible for that.


    As for bad faith, I have no faith to lose, and you know it.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

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  4. #314
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Pan in Greek meant "all." Pan the was the god of nature, and nature kind of by its definition is all (in a broad sense). A pantheist believes that all is god, and god is all- or more generally that god and nature are the same.

    You see dear Mole, sometimes there actually is an answer to your questions.
    But, my dear greenfairy, there is an actual God called Pan.

    It is all very well to say pan means all in Ancient Greek but it is simply a way of avoiding the the actual God Pan.

    So it seems to me that pantheism is the theism we have when we are not having any theism.

  5. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    That's not what the term means. If this is somehow about Julia Gillard losing the election, I'm sorry, but I wasn't responsible for that.


    As for bad faith, I have no faith to lose, and you know it.
    Let me press the point: so if you have no faith to lose, why call yourself a pantheist. This would seem to be simply meretricious.

  6. #316
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    But, my dear greenfairy, there is an actual God called Pan.

    It is all very well to say pan means all in Ancient Greek but it is simply a way of avoiding the the actual God Pan.

    So it seems to me that pantheism is the theism we have when we are not having any theism.
    In a way, pantheists actually are worshiping the God Pan because they worship nature and nature is God. Then again, they usually don't name their god Pan, so I concede you have a point. I suppose only the ancient Greeks know the relation among terms- but modern pantheists and they will never talk, so the question may never be answered.

    Indeed, pantheism is theism and atheism at the same time!

  7. #317
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    In a way, pantheists actually are worshiping the God Pan because they worship nature and nature is God. Then again, they usually don't name their god Pan, so I concede you have a point. I suppose only the ancient Greeks know the relation among terms- but modern pantheists and they will never talk, so the question may never be answered.

    Indeed, pantheism is theism and atheism at the same time!
    People who have things more strictly divided up into "good" and "bad" have a hard time with pantheism, because of this.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

    Visit my Johari:
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  8. #318
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    People who have things more strictly divided up into "good" and "bad" have a hard time with pantheism, because of this.
    Right. Western dualism versus Eastern holism. But the two are coming closer together...

    *Western of course meaning monotheistic. Before monotheism, like earlier than 5,000 years ago (for about 120,000 years), people viewed the world in about the same way.

  9. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    In a way, pantheists actually are worshiping the God Pan because they worship nature and nature is God. Then again, they usually don't name their god Pan, so I concede you have a point. I suppose only the ancient Greeks know the relation among terms- but modern pantheists and they will never talk, so the question may never be answered.

    Indeed, pantheism is theism and atheism at the same time!
    The God Pan is a supernatural Being and I don't think he would take very kindly to be lumped in with atheists.

    Next time you get lost in the Bush, as the dark closes in, as the dingos howl, and you can hear the Bunyip blundering around, as all the nocturnal marsupials come awake and watch you from behind every tree and log, you might regret dissing the God Pan.

  10. #320
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    The God Pan is a supernatural Being and I don't think he would take very kindly to be lumped in with atheists.

    Next time you get lost in the Bush, as the dark closes in, as the dingos howl, and you can hear the Bunyip blundering around, as all the nocturnal marsupials come awake and watch you from behind every tree and log, you might regret dissing the God Pan.
    Pff. I ain't dissing him. He's a pantheist himself. We're good friends.

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