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  1. #81
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    You mean you talk to god ? Otherwise I don't see how anybody could have anything else than a formal education when it comes to theology.
    You don't even understand your own implications.

    I'm sorry, I tend to assume i'm talking to able minded individuals. You don't explain how you open doors to people, do you ? Well, the same goes for what's implied by what I say, if you don't get it well, your loss, I just can't bring myself to care. sowy
    Let me know when you turn sixteen and are old enough to communicate with skill.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  2. #82
    PEST that STEPs on PETS stellar renegade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jewelchild View Post
    Loving God = Keeping God's commandments.

    "Whoever has my commandments and keeps them, he it is who loves me. And he who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and manifest myself to him." - John 14:21

    "For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments." 1 John 5:3a


    Not Keeping God's commandments results in Punishment, Separation, Destruction, & Death.

    "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Romans 6:23

    "You shall not make for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments." -Exodus 20:4-6 (Part of the Ten Commandments)

    "... when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might..." 1 Thessalonians 1:7-9
    But it doesn't seem to be so cut and dry...

    All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God's sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
    Romans 2:12-16

    I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd.
    John 10:16

    Excuse me for a moment for taking issue with this but it's not personal and it needs to be said:

    God doesn't discriminate. It's not your theological beliefs or commitment to empty rituals that get you His favor. The religious elite would have you believe that. God judges people based on their heart, how they really are. Else why would Jesus condemn those who followed the law!?

    Following religion doesn't get you into heaven!

    How could God both be fair and discriminate based on whether you were a part of a certain institution or tradition!? If both Paul and Jesus say that there are those who aren't a part of it that are considered acceptable and that many who are a part of it aren't, then why do we make it sound like you have to be a part of this or that club to make it!?

    Having faith in God isn't about being in a club!

    God made us all and loves us all. If he didn't clearly outline everything in a systematic statement beforehand, then evidently that's not the way He wants us to learn about Him. People will say, "Creation teaches us about the nature of God," and they're right. We learn about God through simple things, thus God can judge based on that.

    I think a person trying to be honest and who considers others before himself but doesn't know much about God will be rewarded as opposed to the preacher who oppresses and criticizes a mass of people for his inflated sense of power. Surely the latter will be punished for what he does.

    Added to that, that the bible teaches that everyone will eventually be saved in the long run.

    And that "heaven" or an ethereal world of spirits isn't our ultimate destination, and the earth will always be our home. Our whole hope lies in the resurrection.

    So to everyone else I say that Christ will save and resurrect us all through whatever hardships we go through, and will discipline us if He has to in order to get us there. The whole earth will be made brand new for us all to enjoy, with the Spirit of our loving Father right here amongst us. Worldwide peace, happiness and love.
    -stellar renegade
    coo-oo-ooool this madness down,
    stop it right on tiiiiime!


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  3. #83
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    Let me know when you turn sixteen and are old enough to communicate with skill.
    Oh? So you talk to god after all ?
    Your ad hominem attack btw, was really cheap. But coming from you, i find it somewhat suiting.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  4. #84
    PEST that STEPs on PETS stellar renegade's Avatar
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    I don't see what the claim of being able to talk to God is all about. You make it sound like an insult.
    -stellar renegade
    coo-oo-ooool this madness down,
    stop it right on tiiiiime!


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  5. #85
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stellar renegade View Post
    I don't see what the claim of being able to talk to God is all about. You make it sound like an insult.
    Well, it's just that nobody actually have a demonstratable back and forth chat with said divinity.

    So, I simply stated that it's absurd to talk about a non academic knowledge of theology.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  6. #86
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Regarding the OP, it sounds like your debate is based on an underlying conflict between two different sets of assumptions about how free will is defined and what role it plays in that scenario. Is providing someone with an opportunity to make a choice the same thing as making that choice? If god knew what choice Eve would make given the scenario, then by default was it god who made the choice or Eve? There is a potential conflict between the concept of god's omniscience and the existence of free will.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

    I want to be just like my mother, even if she is bat-shit crazy.

  7. #87
    PEST that STEPs on PETS stellar renegade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Well, it's just that nobody actually have a demonstratable back and forth chat with said divinity.

    So, I simply stated that it's absurd to talk about a non academic knowledge of theology.
    Why is it that you seem more polite to me than to others? Cuz you don't want to get beat up on the playground later?

    Anyways, while I think it's probably possible to have a "demonstratable back and forth" with God, it's more likely to take place within the context of a community setting. Which brings me to another point, I'm sure a non academic knowledge of theology can be said to be had from within a dynamic, interacting, mutually contributing Christian community. That might sound strange at first until you really see it in action. There's an understanding of God that one can get by sharing your most intimate thoughts and feelings with others that you can't quite get any other way.
    -stellar renegade
    coo-oo-ooool this madness down,
    stop it right on tiiiiime!


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  8. #88
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stellar renegade View Post
    Why is it that you seem more polite to me than to others? Cuz you don't want to get beat up on the playground later?
    I don't think i've even been the fearful type, but hey, dream on.
    I'm not being polite, i'm never being polite, I just mean what i say. Now if you interprete things, it's exactly what it is, an (inaccurate) interpretation.
    In my opinion, religious belief is clearly a delusion, and the only reason why religious people don't realise this is exactly BECAUSE they are under a delusion.

    But it isn't an insult, it's just an opinion, I'm not trying to 'be mean' or anything.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  9. #89
    PEST that STEPs on PETS stellar renegade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    But it isn't an insult, it's just an opinion, I'm not trying to 'be mean' or anything.
    No, I was talking about your sarcastic insinuations about the people you debate with, not your arguments themselves.
    -stellar renegade
    coo-oo-ooool this madness down,
    stop it right on tiiiiime!


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  10. #90
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stellar renegade View Post
    No, I was talking about your sarcastic insinuations about the people you debate with, not your arguments themselves.
    ah, that comes from my tendency to be a smug asshole
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

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