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View Poll Results: Who was Jesus?

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  • The Son of God (in the traditionally understood evangelical sense)

    43 37.72%
  • A very good and wise man.

    22 19.30%
  • Definitely more than human... but nothing else can be said with clarity.

    7 6.14%
  • A man tapped into the "ineffable Greatness" of the cosmos/universe.

    3 2.63%
  • A idiosyncratic nut.

    9 7.89%
  • It is unclear whether Jesus actually lived.

    21 18.42%
  • Jesus existed, but it's unsure whether he was human or "more than human"/godly.

    9 7.89%
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Thread: Who Was Jesus?

  1. #21
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I don't know if I agree with that...
    Oh -- you're mocking me now, aren't you!?



    I imagine there are many ways to skin a cat here, so to speak. I'm sure my "say absolutely nothing with any degree of certitude" approach is equally maddening to some and proportionally not-maddening to others.
    You know, for a supposed J, you are sooooooo P sometimes. (Or maybe it's just Ni. What was your Ni function strength again?)

    I know I was being somewhat overblown. I was hoping Obie would respond to the poke and share something personal, but I suppose I was far too transparent in my intentions...

    I am seriously interested in the "core incidents/points" that particular people choose to stake their soul on a particular faith POV.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #22
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    It sounds like you should give up witnessing. Sharing your reasoning and story is rather essential to passing on the spark, isn't it?
    Are you having a bad day, Jen?

    It appears as though I'm irritating you, though I'm uncertain whether it's only me or just everything.

  3. #23
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    Are you having a bad day, Jen? It appears as though I'm irritating you, though I'm uncertain whether it's only me or just everything.
    No, I'm having a good day.

    You just happened to do something that does irritate me regardless of who does it: When I ask a question, they say, "Oh, you don't really want to know the answer and nothing I say will please you, so I won't even make an effort."

    Where, as I said, in honesty, I want to know what the "definitive points" are. Now (1) I'm left wondering whether any truly exist and (2) I feel blown off and not taken seriously.

    Note that I do take your opinions seriously (a compliment to you), if I care so much about why you've chosen to believe a certain thing. If I thought you were an imbecile, with no foundation for anything, I would not waste my time asking.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  4. #24
    Oberon
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    No, I'm having a good day.

    You just happened to do something that does irritate me regardless of who does it: When I ask a question, they say, "Oh, you don't really want to know the answer and nothing I say will please you, so I won't even make an effort."

    Where, as I said, in honesty, I want to know what the "definitive points" are. Now (1) I'm left wondering whether any truly exist and (2) I feel blown off and not taken seriously.

    Note that I do take your opinions seriously (a compliment to you), if I care so much about why you've chosen to believe a certain thing. If I thought you were an imbecile, with no foundation for anything, I would not waste my time asking.

    Okay, I'll spell it out for you: I'm not sure I really want to.

    My earlier post was drawn from objective sources, though from it I drew subjective conclusions. I posted it as evidence, not proof. You're free to disagree with it. Tear it apart if you like...and so you did.

    However, I'm not sure I'm willing to put my heart and soul up on this board to be deconstructed.

  5. #25
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    Okay, I'll spell it out for you: I'm not sure I really want to.

    My earlier post was drawn from objective sources, though from it I drew subjective conclusions. I posted it as evidence, not proof. You're free to disagree with it. Tear it apart if you like...and so you did.

    However, I'm not sure I'm willing to put my heart and soul up on this board to be deconstructed.
    This is why my husband says he no longer posts/PMs about his beliefs. If it were a matter of completely logical and impersonal conclusions, he would welcome the critique, but since it's so tightly braided with his deepest and rawest self, it's like removing his skin and putting his insides up for inspection.

    I guess I can do it, to a degree anyway, because my deeply-held beliefs typically center around avoiding certainty and I can't articulate the more personal aspects anyway, so they don't tend to see light very often.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
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  6. #26
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    Okay, I'll spell it out for you: I'm not sure I really want to.

    My earlier post was drawn from objective sources, though from it I drew subjective conclusions. I posted it as evidence, not proof. You're free to disagree with it. Tear it apart if you like...and so you did.

    However, I'm not sure I'm willing to put my heart and soul up on this board to be deconstructed.
    All right. I can accept that, then.
    (You could.... PM me? )

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    I guess I can do it, to a degree anyway, because my deeply-held beliefs typically center around avoiding certainty and I can't articulate the more personal aspects anyway, so they don't tend to see light very often.
    Sigh. Maybe that is it for me too -- my deepest held convictions are, well, ambiguous. So I can flex with anyone... or against them.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #27
    Glowy Goopy Goodness The_Liquid_Laser's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oberon67 View Post
    Okay, I'll spell it out for you: I'm not sure I really want to.

    My earlier post was drawn from objective sources, though from it I drew subjective conclusions. I posted it as evidence, not proof. You're free to disagree with it. Tear it apart if you like...and so you did.

    However, I'm not sure I'm willing to put my heart and soul up on this board to be deconstructed.
    Posting about such things before a group of NT's is somewhat akin to "casting pearls before swine". Highly analytical swine.
    My wife and I made a game to teach kids about nutrition. Please try our game and vote for us to win. (Voting period: July 14 - August 14)
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  8. #28
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Liquid_Laser View Post
    Posting about such things before a group of NT's is somewhat akin to "casting pearls before swine". Highly analytical swine.
    Hmmm that reminds me -- Where's Nat?

    (I'm referring to the Flying Pigs... not to her!)
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  9. #29
    Senior Member Sahara's Avatar
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    I'm just not sure wether he lived, or wether he was what is written about him, or some image conjured up from previous religions that also feature mother and baby god connections, so I have no idea what I think of the man, not with so many different things to believe in/consider.

    A P trying to make a decision.
    "No one can be free of the chains that surround them"

  10. #30
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    For me, the point is not whether did he exist or not, or whether was he the son of God or not. What the scriptures count about Christ, the way he is presented, his actions, way of thinking, his character, etc. for me, might this be true, tale, or whatever, there is a person there described as very progressive in a conservative society, who stood up for himself and his opinion. Somebody who offered different and innovative point of view (given the era and society he lived in), and who said things that one can consider them and extract interesting conclusions. And in that lays the value of his teaching.

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