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  1. #461
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Most N's aren't religious? That isn't true at all. Broad over-generalization. You may say that N's may not necessarily be as prone to follow extremely organized religion, but not that "most" aren't religious in any way, shape, or form.

    There are quite a few religions out there.
    he did say most, which is statistically true.

  2. #462
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    I'm a Christian of the more liberal, gnostic variety. Technically I'm a registered Methodist, and that's partially because I find their church to be more accepting of different types of people than others, while still following a form of worship that I feel comfortable with.

  3. #463
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    Quote Originally Posted by wastrd View Post
    he did say most, which is statistically true.
    I want to see these statistics, then, not just of the people on this forum but of N's in general.

    It seems mighty strange to be since several famous religious or spiritual leaders have been N's...

  4. #464
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I want to see these statistics, then, not just of the people on this forum but of N's in general.

    It seems mighty strange to be since several famous religious or spiritual leaders have been N's...
    useless and I can't be bothered with it. Most Ns aren't religious, most SJs are.

  5. #465
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    Most N's aren't religious? That isn't true at all. Broad over-generalization. You may say that N's may not necessarily be as prone to follow extremely organized religion, but not that "most" aren't religious in any way, shape, or form.

    There are quite a few religions out there.
    Oh. I guess I meant that they're not followers of the organized Christianity. Mostly because I tend to forget that there's anything else that falls under the category of "religion."

    The kind of religion you follow, that's more accepting of people of different types... that's a good example of how someone might try to hold onto parts of Christianity without embracing the entire oppressive, right-wing agenda of organized religion that most of it's followers embrace. I definitely respect that.

    I just found it easier to decide religion probably wasn't for me, and that Christianity... well, I wasn't going to do anything that might indicate approval of their unfair right-wing agenda. Because I and several of my friends are people that would be personally affected by it if it came to pass.

    It's really hard not to hate and fear Christians when I've observed their attempts to impose arbitrary right-wing values and morality on people via legislation. Live your own life the way you want, but don't tell me how to live mine... that was all I wanted, but they want to "compassionately" enforce compliance and punish noncompliance with their ideas. If they want to play that game, I don't have much choice but to undermine them wherever I can, because I can't abide that.

    I suppose I'm not religious because to me, religion just seems like a tool of oppression, and it's going to take me a long time to ever open my mind enough to see it in any other light.

  6. #466
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    So Athenian, care to intrigue me in explaining where a Christian like Cardinal John Henry Newman would fall within your categorizing of believers?

  7. #467
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    So Athenian, care to intrigue me in explaining where a Christian like Cardinal John Henry Newman would fall within your categorizing of believers?
    Athenian seems unwilling to ever post about actual people. Only theoretical, narrow categories of people that all think exactly alike and exist in his head.
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  8. #468
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffster View Post
    Athenian seems unwilling to ever post about actual people. Only theoretical, narrow categories of people that all think exactly alike and exist in his head.
    Yeah really. Religions are not monoliths, and the variety one finds among religious people mirrors the variety found among people anywhere else.

    Quote Originally Posted by marmalade.sunrise View Post
    I want to see these statistics, then, not just of the people on this forum but of N's in general.

    It seems mighty strange to be since several famous religious or spiritual leaders have been N's...
    Even if this claim is true, it still doesn't invalidate religious claims. It's more of an attempt to explain away religion rather than actually address its claims.

  9. #469
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    So Athenian, care to intrigue me in explaining where a Christian like Cardinal John Henry Newman would fall within your categorizing of believers?
    I don't think I'd consider him to be one of the Christians I'm looking for. He seems too open-minded and willing to change his mind about things, and even admits that without an internal conviction that not everyone has, it's quite reasonable for someone to be agnostic.

    To be honest, I don't really know anything about Catholicism or other branches of Christianity. When I say "Christianity," I pretty much mean the Christians in the United States that are trying to impose their right-wing agenda on people like me, justifying their position only with quotes from the Bible. My fear and contempt for these particular people is the reason I go around saying how much I'm opposed to Christians. Looks like I need to define what I'm opposed to a little more precisely.

  10. #470
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    I don't think I'd consider him to be one of the Christians I'm looking for. He seems too open-minded and willing to change his mind about things, and even admits that without an internal conviction that not everyone has, it's quite reasonable for someone to be agnostic.
    He was also a staunch critic of Liberal Christianity and a defender of tradition, hence why he converted to Catholicism.

    To be honest, I don't really know anything about Catholicism or other branches of Christianity. When I say "Christianity," I pretty much mean the Christians in the United States that are trying to impose their right-wing agenda on people like me, justifying their position only with quotes from the Bible.
    Perhaps you should use more proper terminology here, and refer to this as American Evangelicalism; since Christianity is a major world religion with a billion adherents around the world - and the largest denomination of such being Catholicism.

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