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  1. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    IMO, it's laughable that your pastor would imagine he has any say in whether you choose to marry or have children. Seems like a pretty egregious overstepping of boundaries to me.

    And Magic, I won't lie, your response scares the ever-loving shit out of me.
    Don't panic. His feeling will kick in. It's just delayed on account of the logic.

    Right Magic? RIGHT MAGIC?!
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  2. #12
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    People raising kids who didn't even want them, just what the world needs.
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

  3. #13
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphosis View Post


    People raising kids who didn't even want them, just what the world needs.
    They changed their minds. That's okay, isn't it? I know lots of people who didn't want kids in their early 20s, but changed their minds down the road.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not personally in favor of this movement, but I do think people should be able to have as many children as they want to and can support. I don't think their reasons are any of my business.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  4. #14
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    And Magic, I won't lie, your response scares the ever-loving shit out of me.
    It was just the first thought that crossed my mind. I'm not honestly suggesting we go on a culling, because that idea is always way more complicated than it sounds at first. Never works out.

    I do still believe all my reasons for saying these people shouldn't be around.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    They changed their minds. That's okay, isn't it? I know lots of people who didn't want kids in their early 20s, but changed their minds down the road.
    But 7 kids all of the sudden? I guess the other reason bothers me is that it doesn't sound like they realized they wanted kids, rather, they just started taking orders from an authority.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not personally in favor of this movement, but I do think people should be able to have as many children as they want to and can support. I don't think their reasons are any of my business.
    The bolded part gets slippery, especially if we bring abstract issues into the definition of support.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  5. #15
    I'm a star. Kangirl's Avatar
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    My response to the Quiverfull movement is: have at it. It's not a lifestyle I would choose, or can even claim to completely understand, but they're free to live according to their beliefs/values, as we all are. Overpopulation isn't something I worry about, so that doesn't come into it for me, either (i.e. in the sense that it might make a person view the Quiverfull movement as negative).
    "Only an irrational dumbass, would burn Jews." - Jaguar

    "please give concise answers in plain English" - request from Provoker

  6. #16
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    It was just the first thought that crossed my mind. I'm not honestly suggesting we go on a culling, because that idea is always way more complicated than it sounds at first. Never works out.

    I do still believe all my reasons for saying these people shouldn't be around.
    If I may be so bold: one of my reasons for your statement giving me pause is that my parents, while not a part of any official movement, DID use the "quiver full" justification for having 5 children over 20 years. They would have had more except my mother breastfed us for a long time and it probably inhibited the return of her fertility. So when you're saying "these people shouldn't be around," you're saying I shouldn't be around. You seem to take it for granted that the children of a quiverfull family will blindly accept the religious doctrine of their parents; I can tell you that it hasn't been the case in my family. Although, as I said before, my parents are not blind followers of any movement, either. But they did take their lead from the Bible.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  7. #17
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangirl View Post
    My response to the Quiverfull movement is: have at it. It's not a lifestyle I would choose, or can even claim to completely understand, but they're free to live according to their beliefs/values, as we all are. Overpopulation isn't something I worry about, so that doesn't come into it for me, either (i.e. in the sense that it might make a person view the Quiverfull movement as negative).

    Just because something does not worry you that does not mean that the problem does not exist.



    However I think that we don't have a key information. Which is:
    How many members do they have?

  8. #18
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    If I may be so bold: one of my reasons for your statement giving me pause is that my parents, while not a part of any official movement, DID use the "quiver full" justification for having 5 children over 20 years. They would have had more except my mother breastfed us for a long time and it probably inhibited the return of her fertility. So when you're saying "these people shouldn't be around," you're saying I shouldn't be around. You seem to take it for granted that the children of a quiverfull family will blindly accept the religious doctrine of their parents; I can tell you that it hasn't been the case in my family. Although, as I said before, my parents are not blind followers of any movement, either. But they did take their lead from the Bible.
    Well, obviously, I say again that I'm not actually suggesting anyone be terminated.

    Further more, my assumption was not that offspring would automatically accept the ideology. My assumption was that the more this ideology catches on, the more people will have kids they can neither materially nor emotionally care for. The world then gets filled up with disaffected and unhealthy riffraff in what I do believe is an already over-populated world. I'd feel bad for those kids, and I'd feel bad for what effect they'd have on everyone else in society.

    Incidentally, I don't like my mother's approach to having kids. She isn's religious at all, but the problem with her behavior was the same. She thought she just wanted to have kids as some kind of goal, and tackled it to a degree beyond her capabilities, resulting in a lot of stupid things, including her having her kids to men (but mainly one man) she hates who isn't cut-out for being a father. I would recommend nobody does what she did, even knowing that if she didn't, I wouldn't exist.

    Exceptions are nice, but I play the odds.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  9. #19
    Strongly Ambivalent Ivy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Exceptions are nice, but I play the odds.
    I'm sincerely glad you're not in charge.
    The one who buggers a fire burns his penis
    -anonymous graffiti in the basilica at Pompeii

  10. #20
    Per Ardua Metamorphosis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    They changed their minds. That's okay, isn't it? I know lots of people who didn't want kids in their early 20s, but changed their minds down the road.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not personally in favor of this movement, but I do think people should be able to have as many children as they want to and can support. I don't think their reasons are any of my business.
    Yeah, I totally understand that. I think my issue is more just with the fact that it doesn't seem like they had kids because they wanted kids. They had kids because they wanted soldiers.

    I also think it's a problem when people have more kids than they can reasonably support (although I see you addressed that).
    "You will always be fond of me. I represent to you all the sins you never had the courage to commit."

    Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions, and can never pretend to any other office
    than to serve and obey them. - David Hume

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