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Thread: Obscenity

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    ...guns are never, ever going away, no matter how much legislation you place on them.
    The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

    Since we have banned guns here, we have had not one gun massacre.

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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Well, I meant "you" in the general sense...as in most people, the common man.
    They can't?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    They can't?
    Nope. You can suggest that the current government is corrupt or deserves to be overthrown, but if you actually attempt to organize a plot to violently overthrow it, it's called treason.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    The proof of the pudding is in the eating.

    Since we have banned guns here, we have had not one gun massacre.
    Correlation doesn't prove causation. There are a lot of reasons that gun violence is so prominent in the US; I think most of it has to do with the way our media is designed to incite fear and intolerance.

    Not to mention there are about 14x as many people in the US (approx. 300 million) as in Australia (approx. 22 million.)

    As for violent crime in Australia, though...check the numbers. There may be less gun violence, but that doesn't mean violent people aren't still finding a way to commit violent crimes:

    Crime up Down Under

    Since Australia's 1996 banning of firearms, armed robberies have increased 45%. If your aim is to reduce violent crime, you don't seem to have done much--you may have reduced violent crime involving guns, but how does that really help if violent crime in general in your country is on the rise?

    Some more statistics:

    Though lawmakers responsible for passing the ban promised a safer country, the nation's crime statistics tell a different story:

    * Countrywide, homicides are up 3.2 percent;

    * Assaults are up 8.6 percent;

    * Amazingly, armed robberies have climbed nearly 45 percent;

    * In the Australian state of Victoria, gun homicides have climbed 300 percent;

    * In the 25 years before the gun bans, crime in Australia had been dropping steadily;

    * There has been a reported "dramatic increase" in home burglaries and assaults on the elderly.



    And my favorite:

    Since the ban has been in effect, membership in the Australian Sporting Shooters Association has climbed to about 112,000 -- a 200 percent increase.

    And you think you've decreased national interest in gun ownership?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    Nope. You can suggest that the current government is corrupt or deserves to be overthrown, but if you actually attempt to organize a plot to violently overthrow it, it's called treason.
    Well that's a different subject.

    "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted."
    -"The Constitution of the United States," Article 3, Section 3.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Well that's a different subject.

    "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted."
    -"The Constitution of the United States," Article 3, Section 3.
    I see. I guess I have misunderstood the definition of treason.

    Still, start a website to recruit people for a violent revolt against the government and see how quickly Uncle Sam shows up at your door.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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    A note for Victor:

    I am not implying that the banning of firearms has directly caused these increases in crime. Many, many factors are involved, and correlation, as I noted above, does not prove causation. But it's apparent that the intended effect of such legislation is not actually happening. Surely we should try a different approach?
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by simulatedworld View Post
    I see. I guess I have misunderstood the definition of treason.

    Still, start a website to recruit people for a violent revolt against the government and see how quickly Uncle Sam shows up at your door.
    Oh, they may show up. They'll need something more than "speech" however, to make their case.

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    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Oh, they may show up. They'll need something more than "speech" however, to make their case.
    Wouldn't it depend on the exact manner of the speech? If the speech were simply, "Man I am sick of the government and I think it needs to be overthrown!", probably you would be fine...but if the speech were, "I'm going to kill the President at x date and time", with appropriate supporting details, would that not be illegal?

    A friend of mine knew someone in college who got drunk and called the White House, and asked to speak to the President. When told that would be impossible, the drunken idiot said, "Whatever, he'll probably be dead by morning anyway..." and in 20 minutes the FBI was raiding his apartment. For the next year, there was a black government car sitting outside, until Uncle Sam was convinced the kid wasn't really going to try anything.

    I'm not sure if he was actually charged with a crime, but from what I understand, the government takes that shit pretty seriously.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    Oh, they may show up. They'll need something more than "speech" however, to make their case.
    Who needs the law when you've got Guantanamo Bay?

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