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  1. #21
    Senior Member Dwigie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by metamorphysics View Post
    A reply to the question: honestly, do you really want freedom?

    Death is freedom, a state of being void of all thoughts and attachments...


    Thoughts are but a reflection of your past state, attachments an entity bound to your future state, and together they enslave a person to a reality of nothingness where the best scenario is death and the worst a contemplation of suicide.
    I am having a lot of trouble understanding exactly what you mean by this paragraph above. Can you re-explain it to me please?(I mean that in the least aggressive and disagreeable manner of course)

    In death reality is neither bound to the past nor the future because neither one exists,
    Hm?- I'm lost here too.
    in death your existence is reborn to a reality living in the present grasping that feeling that seemed to always torment you and slip from the fringes of your mind -- But I thought we weren't talking about physical death:shock:? I'm seriously getting lost.
    happiness; the feeling of well being; a state where the current mind is one with your surroundings and your instinctual desires( what do you mean by instinctual desire?) depicted by these present entities; the oneness of self.
    I think I'm getting lost in the terms here. I probably jumped to a conclusion earlier on by only taking death in the physical sense of the word but I'm very confused here.(Interesting topic though by the way)

    Only(why "only?") in death can one be free and only(same) in freedom can one be happy. So, do I truly want freedom, you ask? I want it with every living breath that I make, every step that I take, and every fiber of my being that lights my existence; The only thing in life that is important enough to die for, on more than one level...
    Basically you desire freedom above all or am I way out of line here?
    Sometimes I feel like I'm "on Mercury"-

  2. #22
    Member metamorphysics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Oh I see
    So I'll define Unicorns as 2 wheeled vehicules and say they exist.

    Great, I'm a genius. (yawn) I can prove anything too.
    What you just did is called sophism. The art of empty logic.
    1) If you define unicorns as 2 wheeled vehicles thats fine, they would indeed exist(for you maybe but probably not to most of society). It was a miscalculation to assume people where reasonable and can infer the general definition of a concept, which is why i later define my term.

    2)What i just did you defined as sophism(empty logic)... funny, I would claim your logic which draws that conclusion is "empty". Than again claiming something doesnt make it true, most of us need evidence or proof, i would claim my proof is in your lack of proof. Who knows i might be wrong and you may be some superior being which surpasses even my logic.

    3) You cant "prove anything too"(at least in context of the form of truth, becouse you can "prove" anything to anyone or yourself if they/you believe it), you can have a perception/definition of anything, that may or may not be right.... and please in the future judge my logic logically.

  3. #23
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    1-Your miscalculation was to assume you're culturally hyperrelativistic and opportunistic self contained sophism was in fact, philosophy.
    2- yes apparently. You know ocam's razor? What is most likely. That you're not as smart as you think you are or that I'm zeus living on the mount olympus?
    3- you can't judge yours to begin with. It would be kind of a waste of time.

    I'm glad you can convince your high school friend with that logic but that's as far as it should go.
    No hard feelings.



    ow and welcome on the forum
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  4. #24
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    The art of empty logic.
    Kinda like abstract art, of this sort:

  5. #25
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Well at least you can hang that on a wall if you're missing some wall paper.
    And I can see a patern there.

    Since it's a painting and not some supposed truth, I don't ask for more.
    Last edited by EcK; 02-11-2009 at 01:55 PM.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  6. #26
    Member metamorphysics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    1-Your miscalculation was to assume you're culturally hyperrelativistic and opportunistic self contained sophism was in fact, philosophy.
    2- yes apparently. You know ocam's razor? What is most likely. That you're not as smart as you think you are or that I'm zeus living on the mount olympus?
    3- you can't judge yours to begin with. It would be kind of a waste of time.

    I'm glad you can convince your high school friend with that logic but that's as far as it should go.
    No hard feelings.
    honestly i lost interest when this turned more into a brawl than intellectual conversation. Lets leave it at that.

    dwigie, sorry its taking me some time, but ill respond soon.

  7. #27
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    The classic intp retreat, never gets old.

    carry on child, carry on.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  8. #28
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Since it's a painting and not some supposed truth, It don't ask for more.
    I don't think the balloon is really listening to the art. Art asks itself to be seen as a deeper more philosophical truth, too, quite a few times. Well, only the beret wearing serious kind.

    *sheesh, the whole world wants to be taken seriously.

  9. #29
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qre:us View Post
    I don't think the balloon is really listening to the art. Art asks itself to be seen as a deeper more philosophical truth, too, quite a few times. Well, only the beret wearing serious kind.

    *sheesh, the whole world wants to be taken seriously.
    I was mostly joking around. Art is a purely human craft. A closed system. More so than philosophy.

    But I think it's more about expressing one's personnal truth. And by using emotions and pattern recognition, which are pretty much standardly wired into our dna, it atteins a kind of humanity-wide truth.

    Quite a beautiful idea
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  10. #30
    Senior Member Qre:us's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    I was mostly joking around. Art is a purely human craft. A closed system. More so than philosophy.

    But I think it's more about expressing one's personnal truth. And by using emotions, which are pretty much standardly wired into our dna, it atteins a kind of humanity-wide truth.

    Quite a beautiful idea

    Mops the puddle that is Eck. 98 luftballons.

    But, can't the intp-dude's perspective be as such too? Personal existential thought of freedom from death? Death of freedom? And, how one balances on the tight-rope in between? Doesn't it speak to a human truth for some sort of affirmation of purpose of *self* in this world?

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