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  1. #11
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    Don't have to do this test to know i am not one.
    .

  2. #12
    literally your mother PocketFullOf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by riva View Post
    Don't have to do this test to know i am not one.
    Yeah...I'm pretty sure no one is taking it seriously anyway...


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  3. #13
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    I know three people who are psychopaths. It's quite obvious from their behaviour.

    They disgust me and mind you they aren't as enigmatic or intelligent as potrayed in movies. One of them is intelligent. But he is overwhelmingly phony it's too obvious to like him in any way or to admire him for his intelligence.

    All three of them are socially conscious and competent mainly because they are parasites but their compulsive lying and need to be influential always gets them in trouble.

    What disgusts me more is not them but people who keep on forgiving them and interacting with them.
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  4. #14
    Member Chuffney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlaxle View Post
    Antisocial test aside, this brings an interesting question to mind... If you were a psychopath, how would you know?

    Modern psychology has determined that psychopath's emotions towards others are fake, that they convince themselves and others that they have feelings and attachments but those aren't real, which creates the same problem as a philosophical zombie, except with regards to emotions rather than the whole sentience.

    This means that as far as you would experience - as far as you would know - you would think your emotions and attachments are real, just like you would if you weren't a psychopath.

    So... How would you know?
    I've previously read that quite a few more intelligent sociopaths are self-aware and know that they are different, they don't always necessarily know they're sociopaths but they know something's not quite right in the ol' noggin. Unfortunately that doesn't actually change their behaviour as the nature of ASPD means that they either don't care or see it as a positive thing.
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  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuffney View Post
    I've previously read that quite a few more intelligent sociopaths are self-aware and know that they are different, they don't always necessarily know they're sociopaths but they know something's not quite right in the ol' noggin.
    Ahuh. Excluding children, what would you estimate is the percentage of the general population who have never thought they are different and have never suspected that there might be something wrong with them?

  6. #16
    Member Chuffney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlaxle View Post
    Ahuh. Excluding children, what would you estimate is the percentage of the general population who have never thought they are different and have never suspected that there might be something wrong with them?
    I don't really see how that's a relevant question, since it can be used as an argument against self-diagnosis in general. The implication is that specifically psychopaths are incapable of self-awareness, and I argue that they're just as capable or incapable as people with any other personality disorder.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlaxle View Post
    Antisocial test aside, this brings an interesting question to mind... If you were a psychopath, how would you know?

    Modern psychology has determined that psychopath's emotions towards others are fake, that they convince themselves and others that they have feelings and attachments but those aren't real, which creates the same problem as a philosophical zombie, except with regards to emotions rather than the whole sentience.

    This means that as far as you would experience - as far as you would know - you would think your emotions and attachments are real, just like you would if you weren't a psychopath.

    So... How would you know?
    The machine is not self-conscious. The machine has no repercussions. Otherwise, think about all the people as the machines and zombies is symptomatic, and worrying.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuffney View Post
    I don't really see how that's a relevant question, since it can be used as an argument against self-diagnosis in general. The implication is that specifically psychopaths are incapable of self-awareness, and I argue that they're just as capable or incapable as people with any other personality disorder.
    Not really - effective self diagnosis follows common patterns between the experiences unique to people with certain conditions and are otherwise uncommon. Here we are doing the exact opposite, diagnosing that otherwise common experiences as uniquely fake for a certain segment of the population.

    I can point a finger at you - or anyone - and call you a philosophical zombie, a non sentient biological machine that is able to externally mimic signs and expressions of sentience, and you're not going to be able to prove otherwise. Likewise, I can point a finger at you - or anyone - and call you a psychopath, someone who deceives themselves and others that they have real emotions attachments and empathy for people around them and act's as if they are real, and you wouldn't be able to prove otherwise, to me or to yourself.

    That doesn't mean there aren't people who think they are psychopaths, and some people will belong to both groups (Think they are psychopaths and actually be psychopaths). What it does mean is that the current commonly accepted hypothesis behind how psychopathy works and the essentials of what it is rely on extremely flawed reasoning.

  9. #19
    Senior Member senza tema's Avatar
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  10. #20
    Member Chuffney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarlaxle View Post
    Not really - effective self diagnosis follows common patterns between the experiences unique to people with certain conditions and are otherwise uncommon. Here we are doing the exact opposite, diagnosing that otherwise common experiences as uniquely fake for a certain segment of the population.

    I can point a finger at you - or anyone - and call you a philosophical zombie, a non sentient biological machine that is able to externally mimic signs and expressions of sentience, and you're not going to be able to prove otherwise. Likewise, I can point a finger at you - or anyone - and call you a psychopath, someone who deceives themselves and others that they have real emotions attachments and empathy for people around them and act's as if they are real, and you wouldn't be able to prove otherwise, to me or to yourself.

    That doesn't mean there aren't people who think they are psychopaths, and some people will belong to both groups (Think they are psychopaths and actually be psychopaths). What it does mean is that the current commonly accepted hypothesis behind how psychopathy works and the essentials of what it is rely on extremely flawed reasoning.
    Yeah fair enough.
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