INTs and Autism Spectrum disorders

[Haphazard]

I've heard a lot about the prevalence of autism spectrum disorders in those who are typed INT (or even so far as just IN).

What is this relationship? Is there a relationship at all, or are people within the autistic spectrum likely to appear INT?

[MetalWounds]

It seems to me that Autistic tendencies would be more prevalent in (or appearing as) IST types. The nature of the Autistic mind, to me at least, seems to be quite similar to an extreme use of Si.
I think that a lot of the supposed correlations between Autism and INTs came about due to the lack of popular understanding of Autistic processing. Many seem to have a notion of Autistic individuals being some sort of mysterious genius. While INTs may have some tendencies that are congruent to those of with a degree of Autism, I believe that in reality, the two are very different.

This taken from Wikipedia;
"- Compulsive behavior is intended and appears to follow rules, such as arranging objects in a certain way.
- Sameness is resistance to change; for example, insisting that the furniture not be moved or refusing to be interrupted.
- Ritualistic behavior involves the performance of daily activities the same way each time, such as an unvarying menu or dressing ritual. This is closely associated with sameness and an independent validation has suggested combining the two factors.
- Restricted behavior is limited in focus, interest, or activity, such as preoccupation with a single television program."

To me this sounds very much like an extreme use of the processes of Si + Ti (In no particular order).

Autism is defined by the lack (or inability) of development in "social" areas past a certain point, usually very young in a child's life. INTs don't necessarily lack development in these areas, they just develop them in a manner quite different than most of society. As a result of this, the majority (A.K.A. "Normal") of the population erroneously assumes that because of the INT's often very unique social interaction skills, they lack them alltogether. Being that the mentality is; if something doesn't funtion in exactly the same manner that everything else does, it doesn't function at all.
Just my observation.

[alicia91]

There is some info about this at this site. It talks about the autistic characteristics of 'systemizing' and 'lack of empathy.' Not sure exactly what this site is - MBTI, new age, ?? but take a look.

Autistic spectrum: Autism vs. Asperger Syndrome (AS). Personality type or disorder

[Fishfighter]

Well, I've taken the Pie Palace AQ test and scored 39/50, and a score of 32/50 and over is said to be the threshold between an autism spectrum disorder and normal.

I guess there has to be some correlation between autism and certain MBTI types (the website that alicia's post links to lists INFJ, ISTJ, ISTP, INTP).

There is some info about this at this site. It talks about the autistic characteristics of 'systemizing' and 'lack of empathy.' Not sure exactly what this site is - MBTI, new age, ?? but take a look.

Autistic spectrum: Autism vs. Asperger Syndrome (AS). Personality type or disorder

I think it's an alternative medicine website, as it's called the "Alternative Encyclopedia".

[Haphazard]

Originally Posted by MetalWounds

As a result of this, the majority (A.K.A. "Normal") of the population erroneously assumes that because of the INT's often very unique social interaction skills, they lack them alltogether. Being that the mentality is; if something doesn't funtion in exactly the same manner that everything else does, it doesn't function at all.
Just my observation.

I suspected this. *sigh*

The INTs seem most likely to try to figure out what to do in a social situation while looking like they have no idea what's going on. They'll be processing, but it doesn't look like they are, and to some people, appearance is everything.

Originally Posted by alicia91

There is some info about this at this site. It talks about the autistic characteristics of 'systemizing' and 'lack of empathy.' Not sure exactly what this site is - MBTI, new age, ?? but take a look.

Autistic spectrum: Autism vs. Asperger Syndrome (AS). Personality type or disorder

I read that site. The only thing I could gather from it is that 'if you're unable to show empathy, 'normal' people decide that you have none at all,' (which sounds about right) but otherwise the whole argument seemed very disorganized and I could barely understand it.

I also think that they meant INTP, ISTJ, ISTP, and INFP, not INFJ, because they had already mentioned INFJ and no INFP and they'd mentioned 'introverted feeling' of the INFJ... and I have a feeling that's wrong.

[cafe]

Autism is also a communication disorder. Speech delays/idiosyncrasies are common if not indicative of autism spectrum disorders. The inability to pick up social expectations by simple observation is a big thing, too.

There is a kind of cluster of characteristics that a preponderance of sort of tips the balance toward an autism diagnosis, if that makes sense. So a lot of autistics will share certain traits, but will not all have the same cluster of traits. Autistics can be very different from one another.

I see this daily in my own two autistic sons. One, BTW is an extrovert of some kind. The other appears to be an IXTP.

[Badlands]

The archetypal HFA is an INTx, but I think they can be found in any T type. If autistics can be Feeling (as the article stated ISFJs could be), what the hell has autism become? I personally find autism to be a label people with dominant or auxiliary Fe put on people that they don't understand. I find very few diagnosed HFAs really think they have that much of a problem, they just think Fe isn't important enough to develop sufficiently to the FJ standard. I was diagnosed hyperlexic at age 2, while my ENFJ mom went nuts and adopted an almost apocalyptic tone about it, my INTP dad thought it was just a name for a set of problems that just happened to be thought of by society as something that made me "more wrong" than others.

[cafe]

I think of it more as an interface issue than anything. Neither is more wrong or more right, but society is not going to change to accommodate my sons so they need help learning to interface with society. In order to get this help, the school system wants to label them 'autistic.' The label is the price of admission, so to speak, so we pay it.

[pocket lint]

I suspect that I am autistic. I'm 50-50 with every trait, but I usually test as one of the IxxP types. My Fe is definitely the least developed though.

Autism is also a communication disorder. Speech delays/idiosyncrasies are common if not indicative of autism spectrum disorders. The inability to pick up social expectations by simple observation is a big thing, too.

I have extreme difficulty with writing and speaking because in my mind, there are no words to match up to my thoughts. There are usually only pictures or symbols that float around when I think...

Watch this video (skip to 5:50)... Dr. Temple Grandin links visual thinking to Autism:

+ "The Mind of a Visual Thinker: Photo-Realistic Images" via YouTube

Read this too. Can any of you relate to it?

[MetalWounds]

Originally Posted by pocket lint

I have extreme difficulty with writing and speaking because in my mind, there are no words to match up to my thoughts. There are usually only pictures or symbols that float around when I think...

Read this too. Can any of you relate to it?

Interesting article. I can very heavily relate to thinking in "pictures". I think in an odd sort of moving picture that incorporates all the details into it. I get quite frustrated when I know I have a superior idea, but I can put it into words. There are no words to describe it. Not only is a picture summoned, but I instantly know the past, present, and the future of the picture, and how the picture relates to other pictures similar to it. Pictures that I haven't even thought of yet. (I know this sounds strange)
Unlike the writer of this article my mental pictures/thoughts are not at all dependent on memory. I can generate associations with things I've never seen before.

What's also odd is that, while I'm not very skilled at math (or music), I can figure out averages (For numbers that aren't very complex) or an end gear ratio for a vehicle quite proficiently without doing any math in my head. I detach numbers from their specific values and concentrate on their significance in relativity to each other. Abstract mathematics (Oxymoron?) come easily to me, while concrete mathematics...not so much.