Fictional NFs

[Uberfuhrer]

In the spirit of Fictional NTs, let's try to guess fictional NFs:

Calvin, Calvin and Hobbes - ENFP

Anakin Skywalker (pre-Darth Vader), Star Wars - ENFP (when he became Darth Vader, he activated his stressed side, resembling his opposite, an ISTJ)

Luke Skywalker, Star Wars - INFP

Yoda, Star Wars - INFJ

Obi-Wan Kenobi, Star Wars - INFJ

Lisa Simpson, The Simpsons - ENFJ

May Canady, May - INFP

Harry Potter, INFP

John Coffey, The Green Mile - INFP

Padme Amidala, Star Wars - ENFJ

Joel Barish, Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind - INFJ

River, Firefly - INFJ

[macjoven]

Calvin is not extraverted. He had one friend who is imanginary. He is probably a INFP.

I think Lisa Simpson is more a INTJ.

Harry Potter and Luke Skywalker are not inuitive. They both have to have sublties spelled out for them constantly, and aviod theory whenever possible. They rather act then think. They are ISFPs.

Young Anikin is a ISFP too I think.

[Uberfuhrer]

Um, no.

Calvin is way too noisy and outwardly directed to be Introverted. Extraverted has little to do with friends, but with how your energy is directed. Calvin is ENFP -- he is not reserved at all.

Lisa Simpson is an ENFJ. She is interested in humanitarian causes (Fe) and is extremely outgoing in pursuing them. The fact she doesn't have many friends is more due to her N function, which is usually the source of bullying due to society's bias toward S perception. Ways of thinking is key.

Anakin is an ENFP, there is no question -- Ne is very obvious in The Phantom Menace -- he's very quick to catch onto subtleties, and he's also inventive (he did create C-3P0 and that racing pod).

Luke Skywalker can't interpret subtleties? Did you an I watch the same movie? How do you explain his psychic visions in The Empire Strikes Back and how do you explain the Force and using the mind to manipulate things or how about being in touch with his spirit? That's clearly N at work. The only reason that Luke seemed more S in A New Hope was because of his family's lean toward it. Harry Potter, same deal.

[Jennifer]

Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer

Calvin is way too noisy and outwardly directed to be Introverted. Extraverted has little to do with friends, but with how your energy is directed. Calvin is ENFP -- he is not reserved at all.

That's possible, although you'd be amazed at how creative and off-the-wall an ESFP can be. One has to be careful with the S/N thing; S's can be imaginative in many ways and N's can be realistic.

Lisa Simpson is an ENFJ. She is interested in humanitarian causes (Fe) and is extremely outgoing in pursuing them. The fact she doesn't have many friends is more due to her N function, which is usually the source of bullying due to society's bias toward S perception. Ways of thinking is key.

Actually, though, watch her behavior. She's not an extrovert. She goes to her room when she's stressed and needs to recharge. She has a solid inner core from which she operates, her identity is NOT centered in the world around her, it's inside. Because of that, I would stick with INFJ .

Anakin is an ENFP, there is no question -- Ne is very obvious in The Phantom Menace -- he's very quick to catch onto subtleties, and he's also inventive (he did create C-3P0 and that racing pod).

Anakin is very poorly written and not well-acted, so this creates difficulty in having a consistent personality reading. Sometimes he shows Ne use because of abilities granted him by the script, but in terms of his actual speech and the acting and such? He acts and talks a lot more like an S.

Still, it's hard to tell because this could just be a deficiency in the script. I am not comfortable saying anything about Anakin as appearing in the movies, except for the fact he was a poorly realized, inconsistent character. In the entire last movie, he comes off as a rebellious ISTJ type or something similar (rebelling against authority because it's an authority), but I can't say that is what he is.

Luke Skywalker can't interpret subtleties? Did you an I watch the same movie? How do you explain his psychic visions in The Empire Strikes Back and how do you explain the Force and using the mind to manipulate things or how about being in touch with his spirit? That's clearly N at work.

Are you saying that all Jedi knights have to be N's? I don't think that's true at all. (It's like saying all theologians have to be N's and all scientists have to be S's.)

Regardless, I still do agree with you that, in terms of big picture, Luke acts like an N -- and specifically, an INFP. He is cast this way from the start -- the small rural boy who has idealistic dreams to leave his planet and find adventure and literally find HIMSELF (the typical NF quest). But it comes out most clearly in the decision he makes in Empire Strikes Back to go back for his friends (and how he words his choices) rather than stay with his training and in Return of the Jedi when he tries to turn his father from the Dark Side -- vintage INFP commentary distilled to its most basic. Everything to him is about relationships and his inner values -- NOT doing the most "logical" thing.

[htb]

Garindan -- ISTJ

Edit: Seriously, now. Mon Mothma -- INFJ

[Uberfuhrer]

Originally Posted by Jennifer

That's possible, although you'd be amazed at how creative and off-the-wall an ESFP can be. One has to be careful with the S/N thing; S's can be imaginative in many ways and N's can be realistic.

Interesting, although I would expect kids to engage in creative play. I still don't think an ESFP would have daydreams as vivid or as fantasy-oriented as Calvin's.

I would suspect that an ESFP would more likely play Power Rangers, Pokemon, or whatever Japanese cartoon kids enjoy these days with other children. They'd probably pretend their playmate represents something else, but I don't think that the image in their minds are as strong.

Hence, I can actually easily see an Intuitive being more realistic by saying, "That's not a Pokemon (give me a break, I never watched the things that kids watch), that's a [whatever the real object is]."

I think Intuitive play would more likely revolve around games that don't involve manipulation of things in their environment, simply because they don't need them -- they have strong fantasy lives to keep them company. So regardless of E or I, I still think the Intuitive child will more likely play alone because they have strong imaginations (imaginary companions) to keep them company.

So I think it is an N child who will be perceived by parents as lacking desire to engage in imaginative play with other children.

[Jennifer]

Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer

Interesting, although I would expect kids to engage in creative play. I still don't think an ESFP would have daydreams as vivid or as fantasy-oriented as Calvin's.

Well, the characters of Calvin and Hobbes were hijacked by Watterson to carry out his cartoon concept, rather than the other way around [Characters become hard to type, personality-wise, if they are in service to a concept/plot, rather than being totally autonomous] -- but I actually lean in your direction, Calvin's mind seems more N altogether than S. I just don't know how much is Calvin's as a person and how much is the cartoonist's N enacting itself through Calvin.

What I have noticed is, again, the complexity of the imagination, or at least how "boxed in" it is. The S types tend to imagine themselves as conventional or realistic things when they play; the N types break out of the mold. My ESFP son is creative, but he's more conventional in his creativity. For example, he loves drawing Pokemon characters, but it's not like he is doing something new with them, he is mostly just regurgitating what he sees. (I don't want to say predictable, but... there is just not that quick-spawning chain of imaginative leaps. Everything is straight-forward.)

An N is more inclined to start with one idea, leapfrog from that to another in an unanticipated direction, then keep changing gears. Each stone is connected to the next in some way, but how it is connected often changes for an N. So they can end up someplace very far from where they started... and yet there is still the chain that can be followed when you look at it.

Just go into Friday night chat on INTPc, and you can see this in real-live action. The conversation is bouncing around in a few directions at once, and it can sometimes be hard to keep up with each new twist. S conversation tends to be more linear and straight-forward.

I would suspect that an ESFP would more likely play Power Rangers, Pokemon, or whatever Japanese cartoon kids enjoy these days with other children. They'd probably pretend their playmate represents something else, but I don't think that the image in their minds are as strong.

Yes, that's sort of it.

Hence, I can actually easily see an Intuitive being more realistic by saying, "That's not a Pokemon (give me a break, I never watched the things that kids watch), that's a [whatever the real object is]."

I think good iNtuitives have a clear sense of what is "real" and what is "imaginary," even if the imaginary reverberates within them so strongly. Usually I see S's having a harder time living in both worlds at once; everything is made concrete somehow, so either they stick with the tangible and reject the imaginary, or they believe in something imaginary by believing it's real.

Anyhoo, I would lean towards Calvin being N, as you do... I just wanted to clarify the imagination sense in S's as well.

[Uberfuhrer]

Yeah, characters in comics and television shows are very hard to type. But it's all a manner of which side is more obvious, overall, that's the way I see it.

An example of this could also be Bart Simpson. In a few episodes, he engages into his "childlike imagination" in a very Intuitive way, but I think he is clearly overall an ESTP.

Homer, as well, has shown some Intuitive leanings in a few episodes that involved him inventing. But overall, he is clearly an ESFP or maybe even an ISFP.

The problem is that with a show that has been on for as long as The Simpsons, the characters frequently change personalities in very abrupt ways.

[Jennifer]

Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer

Yeah, characters in comics and television shows are very hard to type. But it's all a manner of which side is more obvious, overall, that's the way I see it. An example of this could also be Bart Simpson. In a few episodes, he engages into his "childlike imagination" in a very Intuitive way, but I think he is clearly overall an ESTP.

That's possible. I agree with the ESxP. And seems a bit more calculating than the ESFP, who tends to flit more.

Homer, as well, has shown some Intuitive leanings in a few episodes that involved him inventing. But overall, he is clearly an ESFP or maybe even an ISFP.

I think ISFP, but it is hard to tell. He does have a sort of "extrovert" feel to him at times. Definitely Phlegmatic, if you use the "humors" theory

[humors = homers = coincidence or not? Mua ha ha! All right, just bad logic. ]

The problem is that with a show that has been on for as long as The Simpsons, the characters frequently change personalities in very abrupt ways.

Exactly. Because the characters are being used as vehicles for the ideas and plots of the writers. I was going to mention this before when you were describing comic book characters, which regularly suffer from this -- partly because some have gone on for years and years, far past the "natural end of their story," and because the writers change frequently and steal the character for their own purposes.

I wanted to say that I think Spiderman/Peter Parker has been pretty solidly an INFP in the approach most writers have taken with him, in both the comics and the movies. The contrast shows up more clearly when he is around other heroes who are not NF types; the difference is apparent. (For example, Reed Richards and Tony Stark are both T types... Reed might be NT, Tony an ST, but Spiderman is clearly an NF when he interacts with them. The recent Marvel Civil War mini-event highlights this in a very noticeable way.)

[Uberfuhrer]

Dorothy in The Wizard of Oz is an INFP, but in her dream, probably an ISFJ.