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[Fe] FJs, describe Fe as you understand it

Yama

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I'm tired of Fe descriptions on the internet that are overly-stereotyped and most like not written by an Fe dom or aux.

I'd like to hear from SFJs and NFJs what their understanding of Fe is in particular. Anyone can try and describe Fe, but I think it's FJs (especially EFJs) that have the most interesting and relevant input. So I would like to hear a description of what it is like to experience Fe from actual FJs. Please educate me and the rest of the forum.

Thank you.
 

Tilt

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To me, I see it as a sort of "social logic" set within several sets of social rules to get a desired result.

Results could easily include just not wanting to offend the other person or to gain group harmony.
 

Forever

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Well as an NFJ it is being aware of the feelings and norms of the social environment, gives focus to what the people want in a decision or their needs being met.

It's a matter of extroversion so, introverts may not be comfortable to do it without practice or looking outside themsleves confusing themsleves for Fi (I know I want to help this person but... Another time or some other excuse) maybe they'll make it through. Feel feel feel.

If you then act on Fe, you may want to preserve the social norms (Si) or the mood (both) if it is appropriate for the situation.

(Ni) may use Fe to support their abstract ideals although most of the time only the user itself knows what they're really trying to satisfy given that Ni visions are so impressionistic and can take a while to manage it into concretable terms.
 

elcie

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I don't know if it's something to do with face, wanting to have a positive image and also being aware to save the face of those you interact with.
My Fe is crappy. Mostly I guess I just want other people to like me and everything to feel good all the time...but I'm not great at actual empathy.
 

Yama

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To me, I see it as a sort of "social logic" set within several sets of social rules to get a desired result.

Results could easily include just not wanting to offend the other person or to gain group harmony.

If you have time, can you give an example? I understand better with examples.

It's a matter of extroversion so, introverts may not be comfortable to do it without practice or looking outside themsleves confusing themsleves for Fi (I know I want to help this person but... Another time or some other excuse) maybe they'll make it through. Feel feel feel

What kind of practice?

My Fe is crappy. Mostly I guess I just want other people to like me and everything to feel good all the time...but I'm not great at actual empathy.

Same.
 

Forever

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What kind of practice?

Familiarizing yourself with social norms, taking notes on what the people do around you generally. What are the communities' traditions, rites, dress, values, etc.? It takes some observing and if you can, asking around.

Practice being polite? Always say what your parents (might've-Idk them) taught you. "Thank you" "You're welcome" "Smile"
Know when to stop talking, when to start, etc. :shrug: there's a lot of things.

tl;dr Be nice and considerate and don't ignore people.
 

Yama

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Familiarizing yourself with social norms, taking notes on what the people do around you generally. What are the communities' traditions, rites, dress, values, etc.? It takes some observing and if you can, asking around.

Practice being polite? Always say what your parents (might've-Idk them) taught you. "Thank you" "You're welcome" "Smile"
Know when to stop talking, when to start, etc. :shrug: there's a lot of things.

tl;dr Be nice and considerate and don't ignore people.

Do you have to care about norms and traditions to have good Fe? Or is it just more about being inclusive, polite, and rather charismatic?
 

Forever

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Do you have to care about norms and traditions to have good Fe? Or is it just more about being inclusive, polite, and rather charismatic?

No but you have to honor and respect them. Sometimes it's not always about using Fe, but if you have Fe aux, it's generally (according to the theory) best to do along with your dominant Si function.

If you have a more specific question, ask! I'm getting the impression you're wanting a direct or easy way to build Fe without having to go out the hard way?

Psychological growth was and is never easy, it wasn't easy for me. I don't have a whole lot of friends, but I'm respected by many. But that doesn't mean I'm approached and people coming to me like they're my fanboys/girls lol. Sometimes I'm entirely transparent, it throws people off when I'm loud and talkative, and playful. And the Se people converse or show in their facial expressions... they're like: "WHO IS THIS GUY?"

Oooh here's a good exercise!

Study facial expressions! Lovely way to begin.
 

violet_crown

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Ok, I have a question, and I'm not trying to be a dick. I just have limited Fe usage and am an so-last, so Fe stuff is damn near invisible to me.

Why do Fe things matter to you? What does Fe feel like when it's at it's best for an Fe user? What do you think is the most important thing that would no longer be true if Fe were to disappear from tomorrow? What is the thing that you relate to least about Fi?

[MENTION=23583]21lux[/MENTION] [MENTION=26163]Protege[/MENTION] [MENTION=19719]Forever[/MENTION] [MENTION=26455]elcie[/MENTION] --Thoughts?
 

Forever

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Why do Fe things matter to you?
From a selfish standpoint (or maybe my 9 bias):I feel it's an overwhelming responsibility that I do not disrupt the environment to make it worse, like a duty or a value I have programmed in me.. :shock: If I do disrupt, I feel then it's also important the environment comes more positive than before. I mean neutral or indifference isn't the worst, (but maybe my 3 bias) feels like people need to recognize my contribution (this could be an NJ attribute) to this world and if it's responded indifferently or negatively, I go into heavy introspection and weigh it whether the people are lame :)newwink:) or my idea/vision has a serious flaw in it not addressing their concerns.

Otherwise, I feel pangs of shame, guilt, and inferiority and my inner peace is suddenly wrought with anxious, hurtful, and dark emotions, sometimes even self-harming inclinations, feeling like I'm inferior and my role is then lost - no identity.

What does Fe feel like when it's at it's best for an Fe user?

Good vibes from everyone, a rising feeling of honor and contribution for the betterment of society. Maybe from Ni-Fe, I'm feeling what others are feeling, so those good vibes help and help me further my personal goals in making a better world, whether it be on the micro or macro sized scale.

What do you think is the most important thing that would no longer be true if Fe were to disappear from tomorrow?
That's a tricky one because are you to mean like am I the last Fe user in the world aching for connection? Or suddenly I am an Fi/Te user? Lol.

My response I guess that the world would become merely to what natural selection comes to be - the strongest survive. The weak would lose their strength because their no longer "respected" enough to bring any contribution to the world. Equality would seem to lose importance, and whoever the victor was would ultimately control the world or society. Fi dom users would constantly be offended Lol. (sorry Fi users) because Fe users wouldn't try to mediate which values are most important to the community at the time. Almost like anarchy, I mean why bother doing anything for anyone else, the Fi/Te user would really stress on the individual values. It'd be a painfully solipsistic world.

What is the thing that you relate to least about Fi?
Feeling for things on my own. When I think about issues, there is no "internal" feeling comes from within. I get it from external sources, and my inner logic helps me see what is the moral issue. I think Fe users lie if they say they aren't influenced by the people around them when it comes to moral issues. You hear that? While some may come from your own logic, ultimately we like to see what's best for everyone. Not necessarily always what is "true" like perhaps someone who has just left religion (maybe because the community didn't make the Fe user feel included or worthy in his/her role) would start supporting the liberal attitude of free sexuality to better support the environment, and forget the belief/idea that sex has a sacred or a strong moral meaning, but rather what do the people want? It's almost a cultural morality. I do get internal feelings from within once in a great while, but usually we are feeling what has been established by the public's opinions and values. You Fi users help us that way on issues that need to be addressed that are possible, like bullying, or hurting on the weak, it's a complex relationship. Fi supplies the morality, Fe filters and establishes. Kind of like in another way Ne supplies the ideas, Ni picks and develops the idea if considered worthy for the Ni user's focus. Te brings the goals and order, Ti helps improve the system. Se explores, Si picks.
 

Yama

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No but you have to honor and respect them. Sometimes it's not always about using Fe, but if you have Fe aux, it's generally (according to the theory) best to do along with your dominant Si function.

If you have a more specific question, ask! I'm getting the impression you're wanting a direct or easy way to build Fe without having to go out the hard way?

Psychological growth was and is never easy, it wasn't easy for me. I don't have a whole lot of friends, but I'm respected by many. But that doesn't mean I'm approached and people coming to me like they're my fanboys/girls lol. Sometimes I'm entirely transparent, it throws people off when I'm loud and talkative, and playful. And the Se people converse or show in their facial expressions... they're like: "WHO IS THIS GUY?"

Oooh here's a good exercise!

Study facial expressions! Lovely way to begin.

My Si overshadows my Fe, so it's been hard for me to tell if it's my Fe that's crappy or just Fe descriptions that I don't like. I think it's probably a mixture of both. Fe descriptions focus a lot on other people, and the reason it makes me nervous is because I have pretty bad social anxiety, so things like "just going out and talking to people" scare me. We're lucky I can order my own food at restaurants now. :D

Yeah, I'm similar there--I don't have many friends, but I can pretty much get along with anyone. I never start talking to someone first when I'm out and about, but if someone starts talking to me I'm polite and friendly.

Is the facial expressions thing like learning to identify different emotions in people's faces? Like how to tell apart happy, sad, angry, disgusted, afraid, etc? I could do that.

Ok, I have a question, and I'm not trying to be a dick. I just have limited Fe usage and am an so-last, so Fe stuff is damn near invisible to me.

Why do Fe things matter to you? What does Fe feel like when it's at it's best for an Fe user? What do you think is the most important thing that would no longer be true if Fe were to disappear from tomorrow? What is the thing that you relate to least about Fi?

[MENTION=23583]21lux[/MENTION] [MENTION=26163]Protege[/MENTION] [MENTION=19719]Forever[/MENTION] [MENTION=26455]elcie[/MENTION] --Thoughts?

Fe things matter to me because I feel like I need to develop it in order to properly function in society. If I get stuck in a Si-Ti loop, and god forbid we forget inferior Ne, then I'm very closed-off and isolated from the world. If Fe is how I am supposed to interact with the world, I want to develop it healthily so that I will be prepared for the future--I'm still in college so I've got a long road ahead of me and I want to know how to use my Fe the best that I can.

Honestly my reason for making this thread was to get a better understanding of Fe from other FJs who probably have a better grasp on it than I do. A lot of Fe descriptions piss me off because they make Fe sound brainless, air-headed, society-following drone with no personal thoughts in feelings while Fi descriptions get to have things like "strong personal values." I have values, and they aren't necessarily a mirror of society's values, so a lot of descriptions I am unable to relate to and it discourages me. God only knows why I feel like I need to fit the description.

Thus, I figured having other FJs describe their way of experiencing Fe, it would clear up some of the misconceptions and confusion that I feel about it, so I'm looking forward to as many FJs coming here and participating as I can.
 

Starry

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One simple difference I've noticed between the two is the source of confirmation.
Fi - am I following what my personal values?
Fe - am I following (insert external party here) and/or their values?



^^I think this type of description causes a bunch of mistypes
 

Yama

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^^I think this type of description causes a bunch of mistypes

Exactly, that's why I hate Fe descriptions and wanted to start a thread for FJs to explain Fe instead. Fe has personal values and a sense of self too.
 

á´…eparted

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To me, this is Fe:

european-eu-parliament.jpg
 

Tilt

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If you have time, can you give an example? I understand better with examples.

For example, I will pick up on people's sensitivities, weaknesses, and strengths... and I will cater my message and actions to get my point across while avoiding things that might potentially hit a little too close to home to them, specifically.

Or if I want to confront an issue, I will casually bring up the issue in the flow of the conversation, and then gradually build up the conversation to figure out a solution. Instead of saying, "You're such a jackass, why the eff did you do that?", I will usually say, "you seemed a bit mad the other day, are you ok? It could have possibly gone smoother".
Ok, I have a question, and I'm not trying to be a dick. I just have limited Fe usage and am an so-last, so Fe stuff is damn near invisible to me.

Why do Fe things matter to you? What does Fe feel like when it's at it's best for an Fe user? What do you think is the most important thing that would no longer be true if Fe were to disappear from tomorrow? What is the thing that you relate to least about Fi?

[MENTION=23583]21lux[/MENTION] [MENTION=26163]Protege[/MENTION] [MENTION=19719]Forever[/MENTION] [MENTION=26455]elcie[/MENTION] --Thoughts?

Fe is just me... I am always just hyper aware of social dynamic whether or I not I act socially awkward. At its very best, Fe is the master of effective, solution-oriented diplomacy and acts as conduit for seamless synergy between people. Most people just eat up SKILLED Fe because it becomes the invisible force that keeps synergy and the overall mood of the environment up... it's just really smooth, not overbearing or controlling, and rather charming.

Caveat - I am making a distinction between SKILLED vs. strong preference because having a strong preference =/= SKILLED.
 

Forever

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Thanks [MENTION=7254]Wind Up Rex[/MENTION] !

Btw, it was really fun responding to your question lol, made me had to use some of my intuition rather than rehash some reading I did. :D
 

á´…eparted

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I think I have already explained some of this stuff (re: my capacity to hate), but it's worth going over for the sake of the thread.

Why do Fe things matter to you?

Because these things do effect everyone, whether or not they see it. Objectivity is super useful, and honestly at the end of the day I would say it's more important, but the subjective world effects it all. I'll draw an analogy: a tuning fork. The fork itself is the objective part (Te), the tone it produces (Fe) is the other part. Both matter, and without the fork itself you have nothing, but the sound it makes has an effect. Fe tends to not care if others see this or not. It will definitely try to get people to see, but eventually it will "give up" and do what it sees needs to be done.


What does Fe feel like when it's at it's best for an Fe user?

One word: Flow.


What do you think is the most important thing that would no longer be true if Fe were to disappear from tomorrow?

Social skills. I know that's a stereotypical thing for Fe, but it really is true. Fe is where a lot of social finesse comes from, and understanding of it. Other don't need Fe to do it, but Fe gives order to it all. Without it, people would never consider subjective contexts, vocal tone would mean much less, and it would be a very dry "what you see is what you get, no more no less" world.


What is the thing that you relate to least about Fi?

The insessive need for internal consistency. Don't get me wrong, I strive for it on a logic based level. On a subjective level though it... well that doesn't matter. Things still get done, things still work, and since I work on the external so much, that covers all the basis. I just don't get hung up on feelings unless there is a direct effect from the outside world (well it's more complex than that, but that's the general way anyway), and it feels like a waste of my time to "sort" them.
 

á´…eparted

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Explain this though Hard. To me I just see a leader and a bunch of followers but that can't be what you are saying or...?

That's not what I was saying.

It's like this: Fe works based off a "parliment" where the external world and all of it's many factors each have a seat. It's a team. They deliberate, discuss, and weigh out all this subjectivity in the fairest and most objective way that can be done. Then, the parliment votes. Depending on the vote, dictates how it's done. Sometimes a single piece will give a speech, and debate with another one. Others, that's not needed and a simple revote is given. Once decided, the commander makes it so.

It's the parliment that runs the show, the "leader" just listens to what they parliment says and makes it happen.

In otherwords, Fe is of many minds.
 

ChocolateMoose123

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[MENTION=23583]21lux[/MENTION]

I developed my inferior Fe, inadvertently, through serving and bartending. You want an Fe expiramental paradise? Get a job in service industry.

I realized I was people poor. I didn't understand most of their idiosyncrasies as a whole but realized I was the one who didn't and everyone else seemed to. I didn't like that.

Now, saying that, I'll never be a "natural". Still have a baby Fe.

Learning all that taught me confidence with any person/people I may have to talk to. It still takes effort, I'm just comfortable with the motions.

But reading through this thread is really cool because it reiterates how I viewed people skills while trying to develop them. (Not knowing at the time that it was Fe).
 
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