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  1. #11
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    The main difference between INTx's and others isn't that we don't love/care for people. It's that we lack both skill and nuance. Humans are extremely complex, and INTx types approach the human side of things in very simple, black-and-white terms.

    There is a huge fractal world of human experience, and sharing affection with only one person hides almost all of that from you. It's when you learn to open up (gradually, not completely) to other people in your life, that you learn how to handle people in general, to navigate them in all their fractal complexity. And the love/caring you share with other people teaches you how to even better treat the one special person in your life about whom you care so very deeply.
    When I first read this I was like, "Yes, that's it." I think it is an awesome and accurate observation of the INTJ type, based on what I've learned thus far by reading and interacting.

    However, when I read @Xander's response my mind started going in a different direction. I am constantly surrounded by ISTJs in my daily life and everything you say of INTXs could also be said of them. They do feel, they have trouble with nuances and they do approach the human side of life in very simplistic black and white terms, which is why people so often misunderstand them as not having feelings. Of course they have feelings. They also feel deeply.

    Could it be that what you describe is actually applicable to IxTJs as opposed to INTXs? I mean both INTJs and ISTJs share the same auxillary and tertiary functions. Perhaps, you have uncovered an aspect where these functions play out similarity in the two types.

    If so, then is it likely that INTs, depending on their other functions, will not approach feelings and relationships the same way?

    @grey_beard, tsk...tsk. Haven't you heard? My kind has ESP (that's what it says on the Internet and the Internet is like TV. If it's on there it must be true.) You can run but you can't hide. Just like Xavier, I can sense your thoughts, put on my helmet and locate you.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14
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  2. #12
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Yes, it's more generally applicable to all T types.

    Xander is correct about INTPs, but that observation is correct about everyone. The brain is very plastic. The difference is how/where/when we end up learning what we learn. I think of type as identifying what we learn first. What's easy for us. What our "talents" are. There are a lot of people out there in typological internet land that think I must be INFJ, because I'm so good at dealing with emotions. That isn't the case. They're seeing me THINK ABOUT emotions. I put a lot of energy into it. Whereas the energy I put into my normal work day (which would drive most people crazy, but in which I thrive) is quite minimal. If emotions were easy for me, I'd not expend so much energy on them.

    Or in dancing terms, I'm good as an 11 yr old dancer who started at age 3. Except I'm a 49 yr old dancer who started at age 41.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Rambling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ene View Post
    When I first read this I was like, "Yes, that's it." I think it is an awesome and accurate observation of the INTJ type, based on what I've learned thus far by reading and interacting.

    However, when I read @Xander's response my mind started going in a different direction. I am constantly surrounded by ISTJs in my daily life and everything you say of INTXs could also be said of them. They do feel, they have trouble with nuances and they do approach the human side of life in very simplistic black and white terms, which is why people so often misunderstand them as not having feelings. Of course they have feelings. They also feel deeply.

    Could it be that what you describe is actually applicable to IxTJs as opposed to INTXs? I mean both INTJs and ISTJs share the same auxillary and tertiary functions. Perhaps, you have uncovered an aspect where these functions play out similarity in the two types.

    If so, then is it likely that INTs, depending on their other functions, will not approach feelings and relationships the same way?

    @grey_beard, tsk...tsk. Haven't you heard? My kind has ESP (that's what it says on the Internet and the Internet is like TV. If it's on there it must be true.) You can run but you can't hide. Just like Xavier, I can sense your thoughts, put on my helmet and locate you.
    Yes, I think you are onto it here...I think it is about the Te-Fi axis for feelings and how they are experienced and expressed.

    As a teacher I was trained on how to use what I now understand to be Fe, in order to teach and relate to a class. Many years later I am slowly discovering my own Fi and inner fluffy side.
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  4. #14
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rambling View Post
    Yes, I think you are onto it here...I think it is about the Te-Fi axis for feelings and how they are experienced and expressed.

    As a teacher I was trained on how to use what I now understand to be Fe, in order to teach and relate to a class. Many years later I am slowly discovering my own Fi and inner fluffy side.

    Yes, the Te-Fi axis is exactly what I was driving at, but I didn't think to say it that way. You said it better.
    Also, I know what you mean about being trained (or forced) to access and use functions that aren't quite so natural to you. I'm a teacher, too, and Si has been the dreaded thorn in my side from the get-go. It seems that The Fe-Si combo is the crowning glory in an elementary school. There are also quite a few Si-Te folks. They struggle with the Fe thing.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14
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  5. #15
    Senior Member Rambling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ene View Post
    Yes, the Te-Fi axis is exactly what I was driving at, but I didn't think to say it that way. You said it better.
    Also, I know what you mean about being trained (or forced) to access and use functions that aren't quite so natural to you. I'm a teacher, too, and Si has been the dreaded thorn in my side from the get-go. It seems that The Fe-Si combo is the crowning glory in an elementary school. There are also quite a few Si-Te folks. They struggle with the Fe thing.
    I think now that Te-Fi users seem to me to use touch (like a touch on the lower arm, for example) to indicate feelings and warmth), where a Fe user would 'say' it...

    I teach secondary, so there is more freedom for me perhaps... I no longer feel totally fake using Fe, now that I know it's not my true nature it seems easier because I can say I'm expressing my true self Fi but translating it for the receiver into their Fe language...or something.
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  6. #16
    Senior Member Ene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rambling View Post
    I think now that Te-Fi users seem to me to use touch (like a touch on the lower arm, for example) to indicate feelings and warmth), where a Fe user would 'say' it...

    I teach secondary, so there is more freedom for me perhaps... I no longer feel totally fake using Fe, now that I know it's not my true nature it seems easier because I can say I'm expressing my true self Fi but translating it for the receiver into their Fe language...or something.
    I believe you are right about the touch thing. And yes, there is so much more freedom in secondary. It's cool how you circumvented the fake feeling.
    A student said to his master: "You teach me fighting, but you talk about peace. How do you reconcile the two?" The master replied: "It is better to be a warrior in a garden than to be a gardener in a war." - unknown/Chinese

    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=61024&page=14
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  7. #17
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rambling View Post
    ... I can say I'm expressing my true self Fi but translating it for the receiver into their Fe language...or something.
    This is exactly how I use typology in general. I use it to efficiently translate between cognitive styles. Paired with active listening - which helps me determine more specific concerns and verify type - it makes it much easier for me to communicate with just about anyone. These days, only significant cultural differences or intelligence differences get in the way of this approach. Cultural differences tend to disguise type, as all the social inputs are different, and certain behaviors associated with type can be emphasized by culture and not by inherent personality. Intellectual differences are just that: if they aren't smart enough to process what I'm talking about on an absolute level, better communication skills won't help.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.
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  8. #18
    Senior Member Rambling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    This is exactly how I use typology in general. I use it to efficiently translate between cognitive styles. Paired with active listening - which helps me determine more specific concerns and verify type - it makes it much easier for me to communicate with just about anyone. These days, only significant cultural differences or intelligence differences get in the way of this approach. Cultural differences tend to disguise type, as all the social inputs are different, and certain behaviors associated with type can be emphasized by culture and not by inherent personality. Intellectual differences are just that: if they aren't smart enough to process what I'm talking about on an absolute level, better communication skills won't help.
    Yes, this is what I do. And it made me feel like an Enneagram 3 to do it, but I've come to terms with it a bit more now.

  9. #19
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uumlau View Post
    Or in dancing terms, I'm good as an 11 yr old dancer who started at age 3. Except I'm a 49 yr old dancer who started at age 41.
    Why did you start dancing? You related the account of how you got cold feet when going to your first dance, but what got you interested in dancing, and this specific style, to begin with?
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #20
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    No wonder so many people are mistyping themselves. Type has nothing to do with emotion.

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