Before I start I have one question: What is your purpose in making these types of threads?
The question I invite you to explore is whether or not NFs truly have fulfilled their causes. Or in other words, are their endeavors truly worthwhile?
First of all we should define the matter of the situation as clearly as possible.
What kind of causes do NFs tend to fight for? In literature they are portrayed as fighters for the happiness of society, the common good, and the welfare of the individual.
Some examples of those would certainly be Buddha, Jesus and Ghandi.
We know for sure that this is what the NFs are portrayed as fighters of. But was this really the case?
In order to truly know this we must psychologize those heroes to see what they were thinking.
Your premise is a little bit odd in my opinion. 'We know for sure that this is what the NFs are portrayed as fighters of. But was this really the case?' That quote makes it seem like you are going to refute the notion that Jesus, Buddha, and Ghandi actually tried to fight for 'the happiness of society, the common good, and the welfare of the individual', which you don't exactly do.
A first step to this would be attempting to discover how an NF's mind works, granted of course that the NF is a pure type.
A pure type being having no Thinking or Sensing function? I highly doubt someone like that exists in reality. An argument that stems from such an unrealistic notion will surely be a strawman.
Both of these are amorphous, as few would find it hard to agree that Feeling is not nearly as neatly organized as thinking. It is moosh.
Feeling itself has logical sequencing BW, emotion is not random, it has triggers. If a trigger needs to be switched on, then there is a cause to the emotion, therefore a sequence, not pure randomness. Example: Jesus sees the sorrow of his fellow people and the oppression they receive from the Romans --> Emotional trigger is set off --> Jesus tries to improve the lives of these people, feeding them, "healing" them, and teaching them his idea of good morals. (BTW, I'm not a Christian, I'm a stout Atheist). When interacting with people, feelers are likely having multiple triggers being flipped on and off, there is sequencing. However it is complicated and difficult to understand for us Thinkers. One may say that a feeler is being run by the people switching the triggers, and therefore not in control of his/her thoughts and actions, but this is assuming that the person has absolutely no control over themselves whatsoever, which is simply false because feelers learn to understand their emotions and restrain or display them when necessary.
Intuition is simply pure abstract perception. From this it seems we are in the position to adduce that the NFs are unlikely to have a clear view of the causes they were fighting for.
No sane person does not take into account details about reality that they receive via Sensing when deciding to fight for a cause. You are interpreting typology too literally.
To answer the earlier question, were the causes they truly stood for as magnanimous as we think they were? We do not know. Neither do they. Unless of course those NFs were exceptionally gifted at the use of their inferior or tertiary Thinking faculty, which is highly doubtful.
This makes no sense. If the NF was fighting for the cause of "the welfare of the individual", that is a magnanimous cause, it doesn't matter the means of fighting for it in my opinion, the action is what counts. Understanding a good cause and Not fighting for it is worse than Not Understanding a good cause but still fighting for it.
What else do we know about Feeling? That it tends to dramatize? Prone to wishful thinking? It seems far more likely that the causes appear magnanimous because NFs and their followers have romanticized them.
You are only presenting negative aspects of a feeler with a highly underdeveloped thinking function, that kind of person maybe only exists in a pre-teen who doesn't know any better yet. Also, NTs have followers that have romanticized them, take Copernicus for an example, he's been credited with the idea of Heliocentrism when it had been present in other cultures for centuries.
Don't say "the truth", there is no absolute truth, except for maybe in mathematics (1+1=2, absolute truth).
they were confused individuals driven by blind and amorphous forces of passion who made such great noise of their endeavors because they sought approbation from others. Much akin to a typical drama queen. All of us who operate almost exclusively on emotion will obviously seek affirmation for our passions and will clamor at great length to receive the approval we seek. This is clearly descriptive of the NF stereotype. And certainly the heroes of history such as those listed above were very reminiscent of the NF stereotype.
Proof by assertion, hasty generalization, strawman. That is clearly descriptive of an extreme stereotype of someone who has no balance in their cognitive processes. This is very similar to what you wrote: "All hispanic people in the US crossed the border illegally, they are all lazy, dirty people, who mow our lawns and make our fast food for us."
In the end, no they have not fulfilled their causes because they did not know what their causes were.
You can fulfill a cause and not know what the cause was, your making a false dichotomy, the options being "they know the cause and fulfill it" and "they don't know the cause and don't fulfill it". You try to make the case that because they don't know the cause they can't possibly fulfill it. The other options that you didn't consider are "they know the cause and don't fulfill it" and "they don't know the cause and fulfill it". You may have not directly stated the dichotomy but it was implied.
we have many stories concerning how they fulfilled this or that romantic mission without having a clear idea of what this mission is, much of which has been fabricated altogether by their followers who eulogize them without respite. They are but prey to urban legend for us to exercise our imagination upon, their statures have degenerated into an empty vessel for us to fill in with whatever may serve our purpose. This is why we have many different sects who profess to be followers of Jesus who all have radically different views of who he was and what he taught. This has gone on until Emperor Constantine exacted pogroms of those who disagreed with his view of that man's teaching. Same could be said for Muhammad, Buddha, Ghandi or any other leader who has been purported to have shown us the path to virtue.
Cum hoc ergo propter hoc. The cause of the confusion about Jesus's teachings is not that he was an NF, but rather that the scripture written by his followers can be interpreted in various ways being that it was written 2000 years ago in a different language and culture. Also I'm pretty sure that the teachings of Buddha and Ghandi aren't misinterpreted in any way.
All worldviews founded upon emotion and not clear-cut rationale are bound to degenerate into chicanery.
Be careful with the word "All". Also, what if a worldview was to be founded upon emotion And clear-cut rationale? You might argue that if it was to be founded on emotion then it must be irrational, however i've shown you how emotion has logical sequencing and can therefore be rational if controlled.
The Taliban, the Ku Klux Klan, modern Christianity, are all founded on amorphous values and for political reasons insist on proselytizing to the end of convincing others to embrace their values. They are all mendacious and rapacious and I think will end up destroying civilization. All springing out of the root of NF causes.
Correlation does not imply causation, once again.
We ought to stop trying to turn Earth into heaven, as we have only succeeded in turning it into hell.
Agreed.
You need some NF in your life, Bluey....Sorry, but you do. And by George, it ain't my job, thank gosh, but make sure you find some.
