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  1. #21
    Member doppelganger's Avatar
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    From among my friends and acquaintances, my ENTJ friend is the best at manipulation. He says he can walk into a room and read ppl almost instantly (Ni-Se). And he has the charm and good looks to ingratiate himself to others and win their trust (E).

    NTs in general, though, will not be the best manipulators since manipulation requires the ability to read people and manipulate their emotions, and emotions are not something NTs are especially good with.

  2. #22
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iHeartCats View Post
    I somewhat disagree. ENTPs are the real masterminds, except that they don't even try to be it, cause they are just too busy with fun and real life to make mastermind plans. Most INTJs, on the other hand, seem to have plenty of time for manipulation plans, which makes them prone to contemplating on world domination, but they never seem to execute their plans into reality.

    ENTJs seem to have the right mix of intention to manipulate, executive abilities and sufficient time for execution of their plans. They would be the most successful at it then, regarding the NT population.
    Thoroughly agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by ceecee View Post
    True, however, an ENFJ would clean up in a manipulation death match.
    Also thoroughly agree.

    I've seen SFJs do plenty of spur-of-the-moment, short-term manipulation mostly for Fe and/or Enneatype-related reasons (2 ingratiating, 9 avoiding, etc.) but I've never seen them really do major long-term premeditated manipulation to achieve goals. ENFJs on the other hand...

  3. #23
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    Thoroughly agree.



    Also thoroughly agree.

    I've seen SFJs do plenty of spur-of-the-moment, short-term manipulation mostly for Fe and/or Enneatype-related reasons (2 ingratiating, 9 avoiding, etc.) but I've never seen them really do major long-term premeditated manipulation to achieve goals. ENFJs on the other hand...
    If you've seen things, then why not post examples of what you've seen?

    For example: Mr. INTJ wants me to stick around his house because he needs help with a refrigerator that's being delivered shortly. BUT, he doesn't tell me he needs help with it, he only mentions the fridge delivery. So he invites me inside his home and gives me some apple beer (explaining how awesome it is), then we go outside and shoot some paint ball (explaining how awesome it is). Eventually the fridge arrives and I end up helping him install it. He thanked me for helping him, and that was it. Apparently, at that point I was dismissed.

    After all the times I've been to his house, that was the only time he's treated me like a friend and not just in a friendly fashion.

    But I understand that, in the grand scheme of things, all his friendly behavior is just manipulation - it's how he gets along with people and gets them to do what he wants them to do. And in fact he's told me in confidence that he hates people. And I've seen his real self - it is colder than the inside of that refrigerator he had delivered, emotionless as a Vulcan.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
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  4. #24
    Let me count the ways Betty Blue's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Opal View Post
    I think ENFPs are the most manipulative.
    Some ENFP's
    "We knew he was someone who had a tragic flaw, that's where his greatness came from"

  5. #25
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    the most manipulative people I have ever known have been definite Fe users. and it took me awhile to realize what they were doing. and part of the manipulation tactics they use is getting me to question if i'm the one causing all the drama and that everything in the situation is my fault. A lot of sob stories, how they're the victims getting me to feel sorry for them, twisting details, half-truths about what actually happened ect. I think they partially convince themselves of this, which is why they're so good at it. Once they're gonna all that drama dissapears and I can breathe. with t's I can spot it pretty quickly.

    my default is to trust most people.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so
    Likes iHeartCats liked this post

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by boomslang View Post
    ENTPs think they're machiavellian masterminds, but it honestly has to be either ENTJ or INTJ. Both are more patient than the ENTP, which can be a big part of manipulation.
    Lol, putting ENTJ together with the word "patient" makes me snigger. Have you actually met an E8 ENTJ? I presume you mean sticking to a plan v being patient with people?


    The answer is ENFJ, clearly. And by a mile, I'd also put ESFJ right up there with ISFJ and INFJ as runner ups, Fe-Ti simply is better at manipulation than Fi-Te, partly because the latter combination often looks down on manipulating in favour of individual ethics and controlling the environment.

    In terms of NTs, ENTP is the obvious answer with that tert Fe, whether or not you respect that is irrelevant, ENTJs are typically direct and introverts are typically less socially inclined to work people on average, the advantage for NTJ types is the long term planning, when they do manipulate is about a long-term gain.

  7. #27
    I could do things Hard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    The answer is ENFJ, clearly.
    Yes. As an ENFJ I can definitely say we can be manipulative little bitches. Half the time I don't even realize I do it because it's automatic. I have actually had to train myself not to do it. I've definitely done some very manipulative/underhanded things in the past and can't say I won't again in the future.

    Simply put, it really does just come natural.
    MBTI: ExxJ tetramer
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  8. #28
    Diabolical Kasper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    Yes. As an ENFJ I can definitely say we can be manipulative little bitches. Half the time I don't even realize I do it because it's automatic. I have actually had to train myself not to do it. I've definitely done some very manipulative/underhanded things in the past and can't say I won't again in the future.

    Simply put, it really does just come natural.
    Yeah, but it's done so smoothly that we love-hate you while it's happening, you suave bastards you!

    And hai, I didn't realise you were you until I saw your video!
    Likes Hard liked this post

  9. #29
    literally your mother PocketFullOf's Avatar
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    ENTP


    Taking a concept to it's logical end is rarely logical or relevant to the subject at hand.
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  10. #30
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    I don't think manipulation skills are related to any MBTI type.

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