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  1. #41
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Mr Wildcat,

    I've looked into the two charts, the extroverted version and the introverted version. I've considered the idea of NTs and TNs. I have some thoughts.

    Firstly I think that such concentration on functions is not good practice. It seems to lead to a predisposition to type on tiny amounts of information and to draw assumptions as fact. This is not a criticism of you or any other, just the practice itself.

    Secondly I believe that function analysis is more complex than it is being presented at present. The most prominent observable function is not necessarily the one most preferred. This can happen for a variety of reasons and yet is rarely compensated for. Again this is a criticism of the practice.

    Third, no matter how long I stared at those two tables (I drew them out as you designed them... I hope) the more I considered that they only illuminate one missed axis. They are designed to show divides which just aren't always present. Similar to the false divide of being able to organise being placed within the J camp. Neither is persistently true.

    What your study did get me thinking about was other type tables for development, something I think most miss in the MBTI. It is, after all, a system designed around development and not pigeon holes.

    (Oh and somewhere down the line an idea for a new thread on what is Extrovert and Introvert was inspired...)
    wildcat licks his wounds.

    You do not like numbers I know.
    As a special favour to you, I left out the numbers.
    Therefore the drawing.

    You are right about the outcome.
    Not about the method.

  2. #42
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    wildcat licks his wounds.

    You do not like numbers I know.
    As a special favour to you, I left out the numbers.
    Therefore the drawing.

    You are right about the outcome.
    Not about the method.
    How do we understand Plato?
    To listen to Gregorian music before we go to bed.

    Plato is a triangle only?
    He is a square.

    Plato is a square only?
    No.

  3. #43
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    Bluey - he's definitely an alien in my book....

    Not to say all INTPs are - I usually love them!!! But this one's so...

    <ahem> well, you know what I mean.
    If you are interested in language, words, linguistics, or foreign languages, check out my blog and read, post, and/or share.

  4. #44
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    wildcat licks his wounds.
    Yeah yeah.. I know preening when I see preening!!

    ( )
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    You do not like numbers I know.
    As a special favour to you, I left out the numbers.
    Therefore the drawing.
    That did help.. still I am often unsure of why you go to such lenghts to illuminate such small corners of a persons personality or the system as a whole. It often occurs to me that by shining such a focused light you are casting a lot into shadow and sometimes to the detriment of the study as a whole.

    I'm just no good at illuminating back again... usually I'm too interested in what you've found. Like all cats, when you've found something your eyes light up and I'm always curious to see what you've found which is soo entertaining.
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    You are right about the outcome.
    Not about the method.
    Perhaps that is so. I would say that, on balance, it is a precarious route to use specifics whether that be functions or individual letters. I use mannerisms and general pattern as a guide not because it's faster or more accurate on first try, it's not, but it does attempt to understand the person using MBTI instead of using any particular milestone which other methods seem so reliant upon.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  5. #45
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Yeah yeah.. I know preening when I see preening!!

    ( )

    That did help.. still I am often unsure of why you go to such lenghts to illuminate such small corners of a persons personality or the system as a whole. It often occurs to me that by shining such a focused light you are casting a lot into shadow and sometimes to the detriment of the study as a whole.

    I'm just no good at illuminating back again... usually I'm too interested in what you've found. Like all cats, when you've found something your eyes light up and I'm always curious to see what you've found which is soo entertaining.

    Perhaps that is so. I would say that, on balance, it is a precarious route to use specifics whether that be functions or individual letters. I use mannerisms and general pattern as a guide not because it's faster or more accurate on first try, it's not, but it does attempt to understand the person using MBTI instead of using any particular milestone which other methods seem so reliant upon.
    You are a holist.
    I appreciate that.

    Holistics is the all out survey. It is the best standpoint.
    I agree even there.

    When we pay attention to the detail for the sake of the detail we do not see the whole.
    True.

    Only when we pay attention to the detail for the sake of the whole we see the whole.

    Reflection is an one way street.

  6. #46
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    You are a holist.
    I appreciate that.

    Holistics is the all out survey. It is the best standpoint.
    I agree even there.

    When we pay attention to the detail for the sake of the detail we do not see the whole.
    True.

    Only when we pay attention to the detail for the sake of the whole we see the whole.

    Reflection is an one way street.
    Oh I do conceed that in studying the elements in detail we do gain greater clarity of the larger view, it just doesn't work to well for me. The larger picture always seems to contradict the study of the details.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  7. #47
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Oh I do conceed that in studying the elements in detail we do gain greater clarity of the larger view, it just doesn't work to well for me. The larger picture always seems to contradict the study of the details.
    Yes.

    How come you were correct about the outcome and yet incorrect of the detail?
    How come I was correct of the detail and yet incorrect about the outcome?

    The reply is the precedent of the question.

  8. #48
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    How come you were correct about the outcome and yet incorrect of the detail?
    Not all details are equally relevant to the outcome. The size of bolt used on a car doesn't relate directly to the handling.
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    How come I was correct of the detail and yet incorrect about the outcome?
    The tire composition is related to the handling directly.

    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  9. #49
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Not all details are equally relevant to the outcome. The size of bolt used on a car doesn't relate directly to the handling.

    The tire composition is related to the handling directly.

    I see.

    Alas I use a street car.
    No tires there!

  10. #50
    Senior Member Nonsensical's Avatar
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    I find my opposite an ESTJ, which, I guess it should be..but I feel I differ in all aspects with them, but I don't know, I guess it all goes down to your preferences..
    Is it that by its indefiniteness it shadows forth the heartless voids and immensities of the universe, and thus stabs us from behind with the thought of annihilation, when beholding the white depths of the milky way?

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