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  1. #21
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Hereby I annihilate my last words.

    I hate iNTp fake's. I really hate em...
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  2. #22
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    I've been thinking of this for a while now. Thought I'd see what you lot thought.

    Right I'm placing my type as INTP (I know, controversial but there you go) so my "opposite" is ESFJ right? Well as that is my shadow profile it should mean that at some level I run parallel to that type, should it not? Ergo the type is familiar to me.

    What I was trying to think of was the type which I should (according to theory) have the most difficulty of finding common ground with, the type I'm most likely to find uncofortable to be around (at least at first).

    Firstly you have the idea of switching around the function preferences as per figuring out your shadow. INTP becomes ESFJ, INTJ becomes ESFP and so on. But I figure that's missing something when trying to think what type would be your opposite (ie has no points of agreement).

    IJ and EP are the same as they both have their perception function first.
    IP and EJ are the same as they both have their judging function first.

    Ergo would it not an ESFP be more the opposite of an INTP than an ESFJ would be? Shoudn't an ESFP and an INTP have more difficulty communicating and getting along?

    Whaddya reckon?
    Light casts no shadow.

  3. #23
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Light casts no shadow.
    If the light is all functions combined then the shadow cast by a person is those functions which they block out (to some extent). It would seem to me that people embrace their shadow though. It's the functions which are parallel to thier own, but flipped, which seem hardest to grasp.

    I cannot operate like an ISTJ but I can emulate certain ENTJ characteristics.

    The point being is that it would be harder for an IP to do IJ than EJ and yet their "official" 'opposite' type is their direct opposite or shadow type which for an IP is EJ.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  4. #24
    To the top of the world arcticangel02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Try telling Dom. My example of ISTJ is something he doesn't like too much. In fact it's the only person I've ever known him categorically not get on with... ever!
    Funny, I know and get along with three ISTJs, which is the most number of any one type I know!
    ANFP:
    Extraversion (52%) ---- Introversion (48%)
    Sensing (26%) ---- iNtuition (74%)
    Thinking (16%) ---- Feeling (84%)
    Judging (5%) ---- Perceiving (95%)

    9w1 so/sx/sp

  5. #25
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    If the light is all functions combined then the shadow cast by a person is those functions which they block out (to some extent). It would seem to me that people embrace their shadow though. It's the functions which are parallel to thier own, but flipped, which seem hardest to grasp.

    I cannot operate like an ISTJ but I can emulate certain ENTJ characteristics.

    The point being is that it would be harder for an IP to do IJ than EJ and yet their "official" 'opposite' type is their direct opposite or shadow type which for an IP is EJ.
    Interesting! Methinks you have a point there.

  6. #26
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticangel02 View Post
    Funny, I know and get along with three ISTJs, which is the most number of any one type I know!
    I think that this ISTJ is particularly "singular". The whole habit of completely being blind to other's expectations, wants and needs seems to rub Dom the wrong way.

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Interesting! Methinks you have a point there.
    It's your own thinking extrapolated ol boy. I recall you saying repeatedly that IP is EJ. Well that much is true so really the opposite of IP would not be EJ but IJ or EP... Which one you pick... or perhaps there should be two... is another argument.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  7. #27
    Welcome to Sunnyside Mondo's Avatar
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    I think it's ridiculous to say that ISFP is my 'alien type'.. based on my interactions with other people though, I would say that my alien type is ESFP not ESFJ. I even took the Cognitive Processes test and then reversed my answers and got ESFP..
    MBTI Type: iNTj
    Enneagram Type: 3w4 sp/sx

  8. #28
    Senior Member wildcat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    I think that this ISTJ is particularly "singular". The whole habit of completely being blind to other's expectations, wants and needs seems to rub Dom the wrong way.


    It's your own thinking extrapolated ol boy. I recall you saying repeatedly that IP is EJ. Well that much is true so really the opposite of IP would not be EJ but IJ or EP... Which one you pick... or perhaps there should be two... is another argument.
    The ISTJ is singular, yes. Never seen such singularity enywhere else!

    About the J/P ..
    Yes. The E/I shift brings about the J/P shift.
    Please read the elfinchilde post in the Puddingland.

    There is no one or the other.
    I see elfinchilde and you discuss essentially the same thing. From another standpoint perhaps.. but it only adds to understanding.

    The change E/I is not in the loci!
    Why do they then change it in the loci?

    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    The ISTJ is singular, yes. Never seen such singularity enywhere else!

    About the J/P ..
    Yes. The E/I shift brings about the J/P shift.
    Please read the elfinchilde post in the Puddingland.

    There is no one or the other.
    I see elfinchilde and you discuss essentially the same thing. From another standpoint perhaps.. but it only adds to understanding.

    The change E/I is not in the loci!
    Why do they then change it in the loci?
    I did the thing numberwise.

    Now, if the loci does not change the number order does not change.
    It does not change.

    What changes?
    The viewpoint.

    IJ is EP. EP is IJ.
    Where?
    In the loci.

    What is the loci?
    It is what is.

    The original picture is called the negative.
    A misconception.

    We turn the E/I around.
    Then we turn the J/P around.
    A mistake.
    It is already around.

  9. #29
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mondo View Post
    I think it's ridiculous to say that ISFP is my 'alien type'.. based on my interactions with other people though, I would say that my alien type is ESFP not ESFJ. I even took the Cognitive Processes test and then reversed my answers and got ESFP..
    That's what I'm saying. ESFJ is part of INTP. ESFP is further away, in terms of preferences, than ESFJ.

    I'm probably explaining it poorly.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  10. #30
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    The ISTJ is singular, yes. Never seen such singularity enywhere else!
    I like this term "singular". It saves on soo many insults
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    About the J/P ..
    Yes. The E/I shift brings about the J/P shift.
    Please read the elfinchilde post in the Puddingland.

    There is no one or the other.
    I see elfinchilde and you discuss essentially the same thing. From another standpoint perhaps.. but it only adds to understanding.
    Thus far I'm with you and I'll go hunt down that elusive winged creature... once pinned to a tree she shall have no choice but to reveal her schemes to me!!!
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    The change E/I is not in the loci!
    Why do they then change it in the loci?
    I don't understand quite what point your pointing to there. As far as I grasp it E/I changes both when figuring out the shadow type and functions... are you saying it should not when finding the alien type? So INTP's alien type would not be ESFP but ISFJ?
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    I did the thing numberwise.
    You will most assuredly lose me with that parralel operation!! Never can follow how the numbers form a matrix instead of just a list of series.
    Quote Originally Posted by wildcat View Post
    Now, if the loci does not change the number order does not change.
    It does not change.

    What changes?
    The viewpoint.

    IJ is EP. EP is IJ.
    Where?
    In the loci.

    What is the loci?
    It is what is.

    The original picture is called the negative.
    A misconception.

    We turn the E/I around.
    Then we turn the J/P around.
    A mistake.
    It is already around.
    INTP = ENTJ???
    Lost.... sooo lost....

    Right, important question, what are you labelling as the loci? The word, as I udnerstand it, equates to a labelled point in space (or in this case the functions and type). Without labelling it I feel like your pointing at your screen and saying "There it is!!" but not communicating it in words on the screen and hence losing me royally!!

    (Ie, I think you've got something... but I've no idea what it is yet )
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

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