• You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to additional post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), view blogs, respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free, so please join our community today! Just click here to register. You should turn your Ad Blocker off for this site or certain features may not work properly. If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us by clicking here.

[MBTI General] Intuitives are overrated

Eluded_One

Building muscle memory in my brain
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
569
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Typically sensing rejects or is weary of unfounded abstract information.

It takes sensors more time to grasp abstract concepts... given, it may take a few hours to a few years. While it takes intuitives more time to grasp simple pleasures in life. Neither one is overrated or underrated. Anywhere you go, some individual has to point out that there's a system of classes that belong to the elite. Which in any case, makes that individual less worth knowing.
 
I

Infinite Bubble

Guest
It takes sensors more time to grasp abstract concepts... given, it may take a few hours to a few years. While it takes intuitives more time to grasp simple pleasures in life. Neither one is overrated or underrated. Anywhere you go, some individual has to point out that there's a system of classes that belong to the elite. Which in any case, makes that individual less worth knowing.

Are you just trying to be politically correct? There will be a difference if there is a majority and a minority.
 

Eluded_One

Building muscle memory in my brain
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
569
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Are you just trying to be politically correct? There will be a difference if there is a majority and a minority.

I'm too "in your face" to be politically correct. I don't see why I should take sides on this matter. There will always be a difference where ever you go. That doesn't mean that anyone has to grade or scale others, particularly when there apparently is no need to.
 
L

LadyLazarus

Guest
Humans are overrated, we're just slightly smarter monkeys with like, mutant vegetables and shit.

In all seriousness, yes I agree description-wise N's are overrated, S's most frequently seem to be painted as almost neanderthal-esque. This seems especially true of the SP's IMO. Most descriptions are litered with the words "entertainer" or "athlete" with no mention of anything about intellect or innovation in sight. While most descriptions of the intuitives tend to overflow with words like "innovative" and "abstract".

As an S who admittedly feels like she doesn't fit in very well with the rest of the population, this is what lead to my original mistyping as an INFP.

I assume the exaggeration within profiles is to allow for ease when distinguishing between types, but IMO it just ends up creating boxes few people can fit into as well as seemingly painting "better" pictures of certain types.
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,586
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Humans are overrated, we're just slightly smarter monkeys with like, mutant vegetables and shit.

I've been saying this for years. Launching rockets at the moon is more or less the equivalent of cavemen standing around a tree lobbing stones at a hornet's nest to see what will happen.

As an S who admittedly feels like she doesn't fit in very well with the rest of the population, this is what lead to my original mistyping as an INFP.

I can identify with this to some extent. I still think I am a fairly intuitive person, I just identify more with Sensing.

People who make broad generalizations and stereotype Sensors as inherently inferior fail to acknowledge that EVERYONE has intuition to some extent and that anyone can better develop the use of their intuitive skills--that's more or less the ultimate point of MBTI: learning more about one's own personality and cognitive processes to learn their strengths and better develop their weaker functions.
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
It takes sensors more time to grasp abstract concepts... given, it may take a few hours to a few years. While it takes intuitives more time to grasp simple pleasures in life. Neither one is overrated or underrated.

Interesting distinction. What kind of abstract concepts are we talking about, though? I think abstract vs concrete dichotomy isn't simply the N/S dichotomy but correlated with some other functions as well.


In all seriousness, yes I agree description-wise N's are overrated, S's most frequently seem to be painted as almost neanderthal-esque. This seems especially true of the SP's IMO. Most descriptions are litered with the words "entertainer" or "athlete" with no mention of anything about intellect or innovation in sight. While most descriptions of the intuitives tend to overflow with words like "innovative" and "abstract".

(...)

I assume the exaggeration within profiles is to allow for ease when distinguishing between types, but IMO it just ends up creating boxes few people can fit into as well as seemingly painting "better" pictures of certain types.

I don't see what's wrong with being an entertainer or athlete? How is it worse than being a university professor? I don't see the SP's as having "worse" pictures painted for them than for N's. I think this is a very subjective evaluation here about what's better or worse.


I've been saying this for years. Launching rockets at the moon is more or less the equivalent of cavemen standing around a tree lobbing stones at a hornet's nest to see what will happen.

Loool yeah the difference is just that a lot more data had to be processed in a certain way in brains for a long time before we got to the phase of launching rockets at the moon :)

I can identify with this to some extent. I still think I am a fairly intuitive person, I just identify more with Sensing.

People who make broad generalizations and stereotype Sensors as inherently inferior fail to acknowledge that EVERYONE has intuition to some extent and that anyone can better develop the use of their intuitive skills--that's more or less the ultimate point of MBTI: learning more about one's own personality and cognitive processes to learn their strengths and better develop their weaker functions.

Hey. Have you yet developed your Fe better? (Oh wait yes you probably did. I recall the other thread now where we've been talking heh)

Anyway my point is.. I don't see where MBTI tells you how to develop the weaker functions. Recognizing something is one thing. Changing it is another thing. Still, it's nice about MBTI, helping recognize some stuff.
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Amazing, right? I didn't even have to memorize vocab lists.

:smile:


No, I said that more out of exaggeration. I will say, though, that MANY people seem to find it annoying that I'm not capable of just throwing random words out. This leads me to think that most people probably DON'T need to structure it.

Gotcha ;)


I don't quite see the structures, but I can definitely relate to not understanding a jumble of words put together without dissecting the grammar. It's an acquired skill in my case.

Maybe a strange question but what do you mean by it being an acquired skill? Did it not just develop on its own? What did you do?


Hmmm yeah the latter I guess is because you're off to idea-land :p

Btw I will admit to being somewhat resistant to conditioning wrt some things myself, such as getting to bed early enough if I know I have to get up early. I know I will be terribly sleepy in the morning if I don't go to bed in time. That is pretty frustrating to me. Yet I can't take this definite outcome in the near future seriously enough, it doesn't make me go to bed in time, I'm just not getting conditioned by the bad consequences in this case :p
I thought that was a sx-first thing.

Really? Why?
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,586
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Interesting distinction. What kind of abstract concepts are we talking about, though? I think abstract vs concrete dichotomy isn't simply the N/S dichotomy but correlated with some other functions as well.




I don't see what's wrong with being an entertainer or athlete? How is it worse than being a university professor? I don't see the SP's as having "worse" pictures painted for them than for N's. I think this is a very subjective evaluation here about what's better or worse.




Loool yeah the difference is just that a lot more data had to be processed in a certain way in brains for a long time before we got to the phase of launching rockets at the moon :)



Hey. Have you yet developed your Fe better? (Oh wait yes you probably did. I recall the other thread now where we've been talking heh)

Anyway my point is.. I don't see where MBTI tells you how to develop the weaker functions. Recognizing something is one thing. Changing it is another thing. Still, it's nice about MBTI, helping recognize some stuff.

I guess you're right. Poor choice of words on my part. People shouldn't try to develop their weaker functions, but knowing when to recognize their influence can be invaluable. I don't know that I've developed my Fe or ever will, but seeing it's negative push and pull in my life when I am under stress is very helpful because I can then step back and try to re-engage my secondary perception to get a better handle on any given situation. I mentioned in another thread that Ti dominate types will feign the shit out of Fe; I don't know that they ever truly develop or master its usage (to try to do this might prove disastrous), but I think we live in a very Te and Fe oriented culture where people who don't use either of those functions particularly well are often forced to use them, regardless of their MBTI type.

As I've experienced it, Fe will cause me to obsess over how others perceive me. I will become insecure and start to hate people because I think they all think I am shit. At those times, the healthiest thing I can do is take a step back and return to my normal, don't-give-two-fucks-what-anyone-thinks attitude and go about my life--this is when I feel the most confident and true to myself and ironically, I think people like me far more when I am in this mode then when I am in my insecure, trying to use Fe mode.
 

Eluded_One

Building muscle memory in my brain
Joined
Mar 29, 2011
Messages
569
MBTI Type
INFP
Enneagram
6w5
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Interesting distinction. What kind of abstract concepts are we talking about, though? I think abstract vs concrete dichotomy isn't simply the N/S dichotomy but correlated with some other functions as well.

I wouldn't necessarily use the word concrete. In my opinion the N/S dichotomy is based upon conceptualization vs sensual awareness. Abstract concepts is the outcome of the conceptualization, which may or may not reach that point.
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
I guess you're right. Poor choice of words on my part. People shouldn't try to develop their weaker functions, but knowing when to recognize their influence can be invaluable. I don't know that I've developed my Fe or ever will, but seeing it's negative push and pull in my life when I am under stress is very helpful because I can then step back and try to re-engage my secondary perception to get a better handle on any given situation. I mentioned in another thread that Ti dominate types will feign the shit out of Fe; I don't know that they ever truly develop or master its usage (to try to do this might prove disastrous), but I think we live in a very Te and Fe oriented culture where people who don't use either of those functions particularly well are often forced to use them, regardless of their MBTI type.

As I've experienced it, Fe will cause me to obsess over how others perceive me. I will become insecure and start to hate people because I think they all think I am shit. At those times, the healthiest thing I can do is take a step back and return to my normal, don't-give-two-fucks-what-anyone-thinks attitude and go about my life--this is when I feel the most confident and true to myself and ironically, I think people like me far more when I am in this mode then when I am in my insecure, trying to use Fe mode.

I totally know what you're talking about. :smile: :hi:


I wouldn't necessarily use the word concrete. In my opinion the N/S dichotomy is based upon conceptualization vs sensual awareness. Abstract concepts is the outcome of the conceptualization, which may or may not reach that point.

What do you call conceptualization? Can't introverted functions in general work with concepts too?
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
Isn't the common advice that if you spend time developing your aux-function, it automatically bolsters the rest of your functions?

I know that if I return to Fi in the midst of a storm, it reigns in and focuses my Ne, instead of letting it stomp around like a belligerent bull, it encourages and solidifies my resolve in executing my Te and reminds my Si that clinging to things that ultimately don't matter and were in the past isn't helpful and refocuses it on finding the information that in the past did help us in this situation and is in line with my principles. In essence, it's like the glue between them all.
 

Doctor Cringelord

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2013
Messages
20,586
MBTI Type
I
Enneagram
9w8
Instinctual Variant
sp/sx
Isn't the common advice that if you spend time developing your aux-function, it automatically bolsters the rest of your functions?

I know that if I return to Fi in the midst of a storm, it reigns in and focuses my Ne, instead of letting it stomp around like a belligerent bull, it encourages and solidifies my resolve in executing my Te and reminds my Si that clinging to things that ultimately don't matter and were in the past isn't helpful and refocuses it on finding the information that in the past did help us in this situation and is in line with my principles. In essence, it's like the glue between them all.

I think that's the general idea.

You are a Ne dom or Fi dom?
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I think that's the general idea.

You are a Ne dom or Fi dom?

Ne-dom. My Fi tests equal in strength to my Ne though, but I clearly use Fi in the parenting role and Ne as my world view.
 

mhc

Member
Joined
Nov 22, 2013
Messages
32
MBTI Type
INtP
The world structure favoring S over N is probably a reflection of the fact that N types are susceptible to living in a dream world. in saying that tho, is it better to dominate the grain of sand in the ocean, or the ocean itself?

As with everything, balance is the key to success in anything, and that applies to personality traits to.
 

Jaguar

Active member
Joined
May 5, 2007
Messages
20,647
The Architect enjoys a good balance between the real world and fantasy.
The Designer enjoys a good balance between the real world and fantasy.
The Mastermind enjoys a good balance between the real world and fantasy.
The Prodigy enjoys a good balance between the real world and fantasy.
The Shaman enjoys a good balance between the real world and fantasy.

Notice anything?

Those came from this thread:

http://www.typologycentral.com/foru...learn-personality-test-learnmyself-com-5.html
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
Isn't the common advice that if you spend time developing your aux-function, it automatically bolsters the rest of your functions?

I know that if I return to Fi in the midst of a storm, it reigns in and focuses my Ne, instead of letting it stomp around like a belligerent bull, it encourages and solidifies my resolve in executing my Te and reminds my Si that clinging to things that ultimately don't matter and were in the past isn't helpful and refocuses it on finding the information that in the past did help us in this situation and is in line with my principles. In essence, it's like the glue between them all.

I haven't heard of that before but this certainly is not my experience. Assuming, Se is my aux function, spending time with it - developing it?? - doesn't help Ni at all. It might help Fe, true. Even if we assume that Ti is my aux function, it clearly acts against Fe, even though it's good for boosting Ni.


Ne-dom. My Fi tests equal in strength to my Ne though, but I clearly use Fi in the parenting role and Ne as my world view.

How did you decide which one was the worldview?
 

Amargith

Hotel California
Joined
Nov 5, 2008
Messages
14,717
MBTI Type
ENFP
Enneagram
4dw
Instinctual Variant
sx/so
I haven't heard of that before but this certainly is not my experience. Assuming, Se is my aux function, spending time with it - developing it?? - doesn't help Ni at all. It might help Fe, true. Even if we assume that Ti is my aux function, it clearly acts against Fe, even though it's good for boosting Ni.





How did you decide which one was the worldview?

God, you make me feel old :D

I dont have the sources from several years ago on hand anymore ( we need more Sj to keep track of this shit :D) but im sure that if you google it, you ll find confirmation.

The thing is that your Se would reign in and focus your Ti. That means less aimless brooding in your head and more contact with the moment amd the outside world. The pare t also exprsses the way we love and connect with others. You ll find yourself more curious and willing to engagem them with Se activities and humor. And it gives your Ni and Fe a chance to bloom because you ll be more open through Se to suspend the need for things to make sense before considering them worthy of your attention(Ti) and just experience them as is. This in turn allows you to see which patterns emerge from those exprriences and predict where they ll lead, bolstering your Ni. The interaction will also allow you to experiment with the 'social contracts' people employ, teaching you Fe along the way while showing you the realistic expectations your inferior can expect to hav fulfilled, minimizing disappointment, fear, loneliness and other symptoms associated with the inferior.

I, for a long time typed as an ambivert(xNFP) due to confusing the strength of the functions with their role. While you typically are stronger in your preferences, its no guarantee due to the stuff life throws at you to deal with. In my case, Fi was pretty much not allowed in my heavy Fe preferring family, so when i was a teenager, i didnt get to develop it properly. When i came bere in was in my late twenties and heavily compensating to the point of going overboard, relishing the freedom

Tl;dr: i stumbled on the description of the roles of the functions and things clicked( its still somewhere hidden in my old blog i believe but im on my phone atm). Your dom is your world view, your parent the way you love and engage others, the relief function is just that - the way you take a break and so on. The sixth is your blindspot- Ti in my case and feel free to ask other Ti doms just how clueless i am on this, with Se being my demon and the way i get self-destructive.

The difference between me and an Infp is that they tend to be a lot more clear on what they value. They see the world through Fi, meaning that they know way faster than me what they value and in what day as they see the world naturally indexed according to their core values. I deal otoh in potentials, patterns and different angles -which means im often reluctant to give up or priotize one option over another as i enjoy the freedom that kind of buffet offers me. I enjoy looking at the world from the most ridiculous angles and playing devils advocate, and find hidden truths there. And my shtick for this reason is that everyone's got potential and a right to have their pov - their angle on life- considered. This is something an Fi dom doesnt necessarily agree with.

Meanwhile they use Ne in a more containee and practical way to engage people with silly wordgames and discovering through those people other perspectives to enrich their own Fi one -as long as it complies with Fi's axiomas. Often you ll find they can pace and utilize their Ne better as they are focused onthe other person while an Ne dom is experienced as too randon, scary and intimidating or obnoxious as they arent adjusting their output to their audience, they re just doing their thing

Similarly- when i focus on people i use Fi in a practical way to approach them - ill use it to identify those i want to be closer with, and break the ice by mirrorring their state of mind, their word usage and comment on the things we both value and start a conversation in which the chances of opening up and connecting with the other and learning who they are while sharing a piece of myself are increased.

An Fi dom tends to come off more wise but less flexing than i do because they focus their understanding not necessarily on the person in front of them but on all mankind and the world which makes them look more detached as they express their understanding of either the person in front of them or whatever piece of the world theyre working on or have previously processed.

The strength or development of the function however does not change the way you lime using that function. My Ne wont be give up its angles and potentials to my Fi who agrees and supports this as this is part of my core values - meaning i ll never fully grasp in nuanced detail how Fi doms navigate the world no matter how strong my Fi gets. My Ne with its love for other povs might allow the occasional temporary simulator flight into Fi-dom but that is more likely to happen when i need that info - iow whe. Im using Fi already practically to reach out and connect with an Fi dom which requires understanding where they re coning from to the best of my abilities. And there my preference once again shines through.


..i hope this sort of made sense to you as these might not be the most relatable functions for you ( im willing to try and do this for Ti and Se but i seriously suck in my own understanding of em)

/rant
 

infinite

New member
Joined
Mar 19, 2014
Messages
565
MBTI Type
ISTP
Enneagram
~8
Instinctual Variant
sx/sp
God, you make me feel old :D

Err why? :p


I dont have the sources from several years ago on hand anymore ( we need more Sj to keep track of this shit :D) but im sure that if you google it, you ll find confirmation.

No worries. :)


The thing is that your Se would reign in and focus your Ti. That means less aimless brooding in your head and more contact with the moment amd the outside world. The pare t also exprsses the way we love and connect with others. You ll find yourself more curious and willing to engagem them with Se activities and humor. And it gives your Ni and Fe a chance to bloom because you ll be more open through Se to suspend the need for things to make sense before considering them worthy of your attention(Ti) and just experience them as is. This in turn allows you to see which patterns emerge from those exprriences and predict where they ll lead, bolstering your Ni. The interaction will also allow you to experiment with the 'social contracts' people employ, teaching you Fe along the way while showing you the realistic expectations your inferior can expect to hav fulfilled, minimizing disappointment, fear, loneliness and other symptoms associated with the inferior.

Hahahah what a nice idealized scenario :) Anyway I get the point.


I, for a long time typed as an ambivert(xNFP) due to confusing the strength of the functions with their role. While you typically are stronger in your preferences, its no guarantee due to the stuff life throws at you to deal with.

(...)

Tl;dr: i stumbled on the description of the roles of the functions and things clicked( its still somewhere hidden in my old blog i believe but im on my phone atm).

I don't know what you mean by old blog so if you find a link later, I'd be glad to see that :)


..i hope this sort of made sense to you as these might not be the most relatable functions for you ( im willing to try and do this for Ti and Se but i seriously suck in my own understanding of em)

Yes it made sense. Very nicely put together. I'd like to hear your Ti/Se version of this :)
 
Top