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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by JivinJeffJones View Post
    So I gather your conclusions thus far are that ENTJs are disliked because people are jealous or insecure, and that you shouldn't discuss your MBTI type with people who don't know you well?
    Why does this question sound like a value judgment?

    I.E. "You're so full of yourself you think the whole world has a problem and not you"

    No, in all honesty, if I really thought that I wouldn't be writing here. That may be hard for you to believe considering your preconceptions about ENTJ's but you'll just have to take it at face value.

  2. #42
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    The 'Me' part referred to "It's not that I like them, I just like having people around". This indicates that he doesn't see them as people either - just his own personal entourage to feed what he needs; "Now I'm having to go out more to find others."
    Isn't that extroversion? If a person needs other people as an extrovert, then they take what they can get and gradually evolve into spending time with the ones they prefer. I'm extremely introverted, so my filtering system tends to be either no one or the ones I like. It is common with extroverts to filter using 'whoever is around' or the ones I like. That isn't selfish, it's just personality style. Even if he is selfish and all that you say, there is no indication that his coworkers are any less so. The lack of greeting crap is very passive aggressive and I thought he was pretty generous in his assessment of them.

    People by nature are nastier in groups than as individuals because there is less personal accountability.

    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    To me, that embodies Te. The need to fill the world the way it should be (according to them.) And if it isn't? Well, I'll just fix it. My GF has a very similar view, except woe to they who step on her vision instead (INTJ) of a more generalised view. Funny enough, now I can really see the weak Fi that ENTJs are suppose to have... something I've never really been able to understand.
    I'm guessing his coworkers are projecting personal issues onto him.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    To me, that embodies Te. The need to fill the world the way it should be (according to them.) And if it isn't? Well, I'll just fix it. My GF has a very similar view, except woe to they who step on her vision instead (INTJ) of a more generalised view. Funny enough, now I can really see the weak Fi that ENTJs are suppose to have... something I've never really been able to understand.
    No, it's not about that. It's about the fact that you can't get along with everyone, but that doesn't mean that professionally you don't have to deal with them. For me, in a job, I put my feelings aside and try to treat people the same. I don't particularly like them, but that doesn't stop them from treating them with a minimum amount of respect.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    Isn't that extroversion? If a person needs other people as an extrovert, then they take what they can get and gradually evolve into spending time with the ones they prefer. I'm extremely introverted, so my filtering system tends to be either no one or the ones I like. It is common with extroverts to filter using 'whoever is around' or the ones I like. That isn't selfish, it's just personality style. Even if he is selfish and all that you say, there is no indication that his coworkers are any less so. The lack of greeting crap is very passive aggressive and I thought he was pretty generous in his assessment of them.
    Thanks, you're giving me really good insight.

    As a sidenote, some people close to me met them once and both told me "these people are sharks".

  5. #45
    Senior Member Chaselation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer View Post
    Are we absolutely sure that MBTI types are about how we are and not how we want to be?
    The answer to that depends entirely on how one answers the questions. Many people have difficulty being objective. (INTPs included) If your not objective then the resulting type will reflect that.

    All typing aside there are still intangibles not captured by type that have a lot to do with a persons likability. My boss is an ENTJ he is well liked and respected by myself and most of my co-workers. The ones that don't like him are people I have no use for as a rule. He has improved his people skillz with age and I think that may be a factor in peoples perception of him.

  6. #46
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick View Post
    No, in all honesty, if I really thought that I wouldn't be writing here. That may be hard for you to believe considering your preconceptions about ENTJ's but you'll just have to take it at face value.
    It's true that I do have preconceptions about ENTJs, but I haven't pulled them out of a hat. I have been friends with ENTJs before. One of them I am still fairly friendly with, though we have drifted apart as you do. I'm not saying that all ENTJs automatically have a problem as a result of being ENTJ. I've simply tried to answer your question as to why ENTJs can be disliked based on my personal experience. It's an issue I've given a lot of thought to thanks to the afore-mentioned friendships.

  7. #47
    Senior Member JivinJeffJones's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toonia View Post
    In some ways humans are the most insecure little critters scurrying about on the planet. Personality types that don't specifically cater to insecurities will be disliked, I'm guessing. In a way I would agree with your assessment.
    Yeah. I have issues, you have issues, we all have issues. Sometimes these issues make us see things that aren't actually there. Sometimes they make us extra sensitive to things that are actually there.

  8. #48
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick View Post
    No, it's not about that. It's about the fact that you can't get along with everyone, but that doesn't mean that professionally you don't have to deal with them. For me, in a job, I put my feelings aside and try to treat people the same. I don't particularly like them, but that doesn't stop them from treating them with a minimum amount of respect.

    Well, then it's decided. It's them, not you. It's not type related. It's their personal problems. There is nothing you can do about it. People suck, are petty, etc.

    So replace them as much as you can! Work around them when you can't. Just keep doing what you are doing, then later deal with people sabotaging you. It won't matter much anyway, if you are advancing, though it may come out if you ever move on top of the group. But you can always take a sidestep to a new company.

    (I realise this sounds tongue in cheek, but I'm actually dead serious. If they really are like that, there is nothing you can do. And if you didn't bring it on yourself, then it shouldn't happen again. Problem solved! There is only a problem if you are the source of the problem, and therefore transfer it wherever you go. Since that isn't the problem, you'll just have to struggle through the present.)

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ptgatsby View Post
    Well, then it's decided. It's them, not you. It's not type related. It's their personal problems. There is nothing you can do about it. People suck, are petty, etc.

    So replace them as much as you can! Work around them when you can't. Just keep doing what you are doing, then later deal with people sabotaging you. It won't matter much anyway, if you are advancing, though it may come out if you ever move on top of the group. But you can always take a sidestep to a new company.

    (I realise this sounds tongue in cheek, but I'm actually dead serious. If they really are like that, there is nothing you can do. And if you didn't bring it on yourself, then it shouldn't happen again. Problem solved! There is only a problem if you are the source of the problem, and therefore transfer it wherever you go. Since that isn't the problem, you'll just have to struggle through the present.)
    Thanks for the advice, mate. There's a high turnover rate and last year it was the complete oppposite: great atmosphere, lots of socializing outside work, coworkers were happy for me when I did things well, etc. But nearly all of them left. I guess the true problem is realizing that something bothers me and I can't do anything about it, I just have to endure patiently.

  10. #50
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maverick View Post
    Thanks for the advice, mate. There's a high turnover rate and last year it was the complete oppposite: great atmosphere, lots of socializing outside work, coworkers were happy for me when I did things well, etc. But nearly all of them left. I guess the true problem is realizing that something bothers me and I can't do anything about it, I just have to endure patiently.
    Yup, cultural changes are very hard. This is especially true for leaders (or leaders by personality)! My best advice is not to take it personally and just take pride in your work - not that you don't already but just focus on it more.

    The other piece of advice is, assuming you are PMing or anything similar, really focus on helping those under you advance. It worked wonders with one of my bosses, who wasn't ENTJ (Probably INTJ, maybe ISTJ)... simply helping others advance and achieve their potential will make you many friends. In the end, they'll help you more and support you more than your peers, which are competing against you, possibly could. It worked on me, I can tell you that!

    (Course, don't try to turn them into mini ENTJs, but if you have influence on reviews, etc, go the extra mile in preparing them. And of course, beware the stress that can cause the negative ENTJ traits come out!)

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