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  1. #1
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Default Can You Tell Me How You Explain Your Ni Perceptions?

    I'm mostly wondering how Ni Doms explain what's in their head. But anyone can answer.

    Do you have to sit quietly for long periods of time?

    I have blocked out my Ni for so long, because I have refused to go by "hunches," without them being backed up by proof.

    But I no longer want to ignore the intuitions that I get.

    Sometimes when I go to do something, I'll think "Oh I should pick this up first" or something like that, and I ignore that hunch (or whatever you want to call it.)

    And when I'm explaining something to someone, I will have a weird source of internal pressure come up. And it's like I know I should sit and listen to that pressure or thought that's trying to emerge, but I feel like it takes a while. And don't always have a place to go to be quiet.

    How do Ni doms function like this? Does this happen to you? How do you explain your thoughts in a concise way, when they do surface?
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Opal's Avatar
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    My type is currently in dispute, but as I still identify as INJ I'll give it a shot.

    My perception/understanding of intuition is in knowing without working, leaping from the question to the answer. The question can be subconscious, something that registered but that I never actively thought through. Depending on the person to whom I explain myself I either state the conclusion and let them assess it, or ask questions that logically direct them to my conclusion from their current understanding.

    In many cases, though, if a thought/sense does emerge during conversation the way you described, I'll hold it under the surface to evaluate later. I try not to externalize my thought processes.

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    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solipsists View Post
    My type is currently in dispute, but as I still identify as INJ I'll give it a shot.

    My perception/understanding of intuition is in knowing without working, leaping from the question to the answer. The question can be subconscious, something that registered but that I never actively thought through. Depending on the person to whom I explain myself I either state the conclusion and let them assess it, or ask questions that logically direct them to my conclusion from their current understanding.

    In many cases, though, if a thought/sense does emerge during conversation the way you described, I'll hold it under the surface to evaluate later. I try not to externalize my thought processes.
    Ok. Yea, this is helpful.

    But even here. I am getting the feeling that I know something that I just haven't thought through yet. Almost like...if I were to sit for a while, and maybe even write my thoughts out on the subject....I could come to a more concrete insight.

    Like I know, that I know what you're saying....but it's like I don't give myself enough alone time to process it or something. I just don't it formulated in words.

    How do you go from thought to words?

    I guess what I don't relate to is the ability to have patience to do this.

    Do you have a lot of patience? It seems like the emerging of a thought takes too long to examine and incorporate immediately into a conversation.

    I would think you have to prepare what you're going to say quite a lot, no?

    And if so....how do you go about new experiences?
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
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    Senior Member Opal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    Ok. Yea, this is helpful.

    But even here. I am getting the feeling that I know something that I just haven't thought through yet. Almost like...if I were to sit for a while, and maybe even write my thoughts out on the subject....I could come to a more concrete insight.

    Like I know, that I know what you're saying....but it's like I don't give myself enough alone time to process it or something. I just don't it formulated in words.

    How do you go from thought to words?

    I guess what I don't relate to is the ability to have patience to do this.

    Do you have a lot of patience? It seems like the emerging of a thought takes too long to examine and incorporate immediately into a conversation.
    How I translate thoughts into words... well, usually my understanding takes on a sort of indistinct model, like an abstract sense of forces that come together to make a certain shape (that I don't ascribe colors or other visual attributes to, but still have a sort of three-dimensional sense of) and I attempt to describe that model in terms that make sense to the listener/reader. I've practiced creative writing for the last 12 years, which has helped my verbal expression tremendously. It used to feel like there was an impenetrable barrier between my mind and others', and for a long time I accepted that as a fact of life.

    I have some degree of patience, but more than anything I'm practiced in my own conceptual-to-verbal translation. I do have an easier time composing my thoughts outside of the flow of physical conversation though. I often find myself messaging people after physical conversations to amend some of the points I made or offer a more adequate response to something I opted out of answering.


    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    I would think you have to prepare what you're going to say quite a lot, no?

    And if so....how do you go about new experiences?
    I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this. I don't actively compose sentences in my head before meeting someone, but I will absently ponder concepts on my own time and then pull them out in discussion if they seem relevant.

  5. #5
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solipsists View Post
    How I translate thoughts into words... well, usually my understanding takes on a sort of indistinct, fluid visual model (visual for lack of a closer descriptor) and I attempt to describe that model in terms that make sense to the listener/reader. I've practiced creative writing for the last 12 or so years, which has helped my verbal expression tremendously. It used to feel like there was an impenetrable barrier between my mind and others', and for a long time I accepted that as a fact of life.

    I have some degree of patience, but more than anything I'm practiced in my own conceptual-to-verbal translation. I do have an easier time composing my thoughts outside of the flow of physical conversation though. I often find myself messaging people after physical conversations to amend some of the points I made or offer a more adequate response to something I opted out of answering.
    By creative writing, do you mean like poetry and short stories?

    I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this. I don't actively compose sentences in my head before meeting someone, but I will absently ponder concepts and then pull them out in discussion if they seem relevant.
    Yea, that's sort of what I mean. I don't think I mean actively doing this.

    Like I seem to have to just wonder off in thought about certain subjects for a while, to really be able to express them concretely. Like I have to follow the line of thought out in my head. But to do this, I have to be alone and it needs to be quiet. If I do this, then my thoughts seem to be more formulated. And I can externalize them in the moment with people in conversation.

    Otherwise, if I have not sat on an idea for a while, I think that's where my words can get misunderstood. Cause the line of thought is still raw, I have not followed it to its end yet.

    And what I mean by new experiences is, like talking about a subject you haven't discussed much with other people, or even given that much thought to. Are you maybe more reserved in those situations?
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

  6. #6
    Senior Member Opal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    By creative writing, do you mean like poetry and short stories?
    Poetry and symbol-heavy flash fiction, mostly. I began with song lyrics when I was younger though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    Yea, that's sort of what I mean. I don't think I mean actively doing this.

    Like I seem to have to just wonder off in thought about certain subjects for a while, to really be able to express them concretely. Like I have to follow the line of thought out in my head. But to do this, I have to be alone and it needs to be quiet. If I do this, then my thoughts seem to be more formulated. And I can externalize them in the moment with people in conversation.

    Otherwise, if I have not sat on an idea for a while, I think that's where my words can get misunderstood. Cause the line of thought is still raw, I have not followed it to its end yet.
    That makes sense about formulating your opinion/stance before sharing it. If I haven't pondered an idea to completion I may still offer a sort of instinctive response, but it'll often click later that day or in days after that it wasn't true to my understanding of the world; maybe I considered a past event that wasn't an adequate sample for the principle being discussed, or misinterpreted something they said in the moment and tried to make an oblique commentary on it that got lost in translation. There are plenty of factors that muddy my output in physical conversation, so reflection and amendment often feels necessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    And what I mean by new experiences is, like talking about a subject you haven't discussed much with other people, or even given that much thought to. Are you maybe more reserved in those situations?
    It depends on who I'm with. I happily speculate about new ideas with certain people whose minds I trust and whose views of me I feel are firmly positive, but in a situation with more than two (very trusted) friends I'll opt out of conversation while trying to further my understanding.


    Also, I amended my description of my "visualization" of ideas if that's interesting to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by solipsists View Post
    Poetry and symbol-heavy flash fiction, mostly. I began with song lyrics when I was younger though.
    Hmm. Interesting. So did you take classes on that?


    Also, I amended my description of my "visualization" of ideas if that's interesting to you.
    Yea, I relate to that description more than the first. Thank you for your input!
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

  8. #8
    Senior Member Alea_iacta_est's Avatar
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    I explain it usually by saying rather brusquely, "I see something you don't.", "You have to look at the problem in a different angle/light.", or simply "Just trust me, alright?".

    I feel as though the differences in Ni (Fe or Te paired) seems to be where the personalized integration lies.

    INFJs, for instance, experience a personalized understanding when it comes to the aspects of humanity, emotionalism, and literary symbolism due to the fact that their Ni is geared toward Fe related tasks.

    Opposingly, INTJs experience a personalized understanding when it comes to the mechanical realm of the universe, the technical information, and abstract theories due to the fact that their Ni is geared toward Te related tasks. Specifically, I find myself not simply understanding ideas but "integrating" with ideas. Take for example molecular geometry, which states that electron orbitals will always be as far away from other orbitals as possible. I understand logically that this is due to the fact that negative charges repel and that the electrons emit a negative charge, but I also seem to "visualize" or more aptly, build a mental landscape where I can watch this unfurl in my mind, visually understanding how this works and tying it into the real world simultaneously, being able to see how this interaction affects the world around me, creating a deeper feeling of understanding than just the mechanical, logical understanding indicative of just Tx. This could be due to the dynamic attitude of Ni (yes, it's socionics, it's applicable) and how it sees how things are taking place in the moment, in the future, and in the past all around me.

    I also must add that Ni seems to be incredibly quick when it is operating, to the point where it is already ahead of my own reasoning and working on some sort of other process in my mind. It often builds these frameworks in my mind so quickly that I don't even know if they are correct without having to trail behind its wake with Te to make sure the path it is creating is safe and veritable for the real world. I think Se inferior also plays a role here in that I get a slight twinge if something Ni synthesized overlooks something, but I often overlook this twinge and end up realizing it was correct.

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    The Typing Tabby grey_beard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    I'm mostly wondering how Ni Doms explain what's in their head. But anyone can answer.

    Do you have to sit quietly for long periods of time?

    I have blocked out my Ni for so long, because I have refused to go by "hunches," without them being backed up by proof.

    But I no longer want to ignore the intuitions that I get.

    Sometimes when I go to do something, I'll think "Oh I should pick this up first" or something like that, and I ignore that hunch (or whatever you want to call it.)

    And when I'm explaining something to someone, I will have a weird source of internal pressure come up. And it's like I know I should sit and listen to that pressure or thought that's trying to emerge, but I feel like it takes a while. And don't always have a place to go to be quiet.

    How do Ni doms function like this? Does this happen to you? How do you explain your thoughts in a concise way, when they do surface?
    @Urarienev --

    I just ... *know*.

    I describe it -- to myself, others wouldn't get it -- as "I just reach down inside, and feel around in the grab bag for whatever matches the situation or item I'm considering -- and when I touch it, or my hand grabs it -- I just *KNOW* -- just like when you're trying to remember something, and a split second before conscious awareness of what you'd forgotten surges into your awareness, your mind tells you -- "I 'found' it!" -- it's the same thing, only it is recognition, not remembrance. But at the same time, it's as though you'd always already known it anyway, even if it's the first time you've dealt with it or seen it.
    "Love never needs time. But friendship always needs time. More and more and more time, up to long past midnight." -- The Crime of Captain Gahagan

    Please comment on my johari / nohari pages.

  10. #10
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alea_iacta_est View Post
    I also must add that Ni seems to be incredibly quick when it is operating, to the point where it is already ahead of my own reasoning and working on some sort of other process in my mind. It often builds these frameworks in my mind so quickly that I don't even know if they are correct without having to trail behind its wake with Te to make sure the path it is creating is safe and veritable for the real world.
    I think this ^ is really what I meant. Ni will quickly conceptualize, and I'm left having to think through everything anyways. And that's cause I am not sure that I can trust all of the framework produced by Ni. I have to make sure everything is proven first.

    I think Se inferior also plays a role here in that I get a slight twinge if something Ni synthesized overlooks something, but I often overlook this twinge and end up realizing it was correct.
    This may be even closer to what I was trying to describe though. But can you expand on this some more? I often feel like I am going along ok, but then will sort of get a sudden notion that I'm missing a piece of information.

    So have you learned to listen to this "twinge" more? And can you describe what it seems to feel like?
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
    10w12

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