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  1. #11
    Problem? Grand Admiral Crunch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starry View Post
    I'm going to come back to this when I have more time because I am finding this really interesting... but another thing that came into my mind was there being a difference between 'feeling personally hurt' and 'offending Fi sensibilities.' By this I mean, there are times I may react in a way that may lead another to believe I'm personally hurt (if they were judging my reaction on "what it would mean if I did it")...when in truth I feel no personal hurt... I'm Fi 'right fighting.' I'm standing-up for someone down the road the individual may actually hurt.

    I'm wondering if this is also common in the IxFP...

    I do that too. I can point to specific instances when it has served me well. I didn't know ENFP's did this. My ENFP was really rock solid. It took effort to insult her. Like planning and lots of being subtle (left my diary laying around for her to read). I love that about an ENFP. No need to tip-toe around her feelings. I could say almost anything to her.

    I'm guessing I use my Ne to support my Fi, to figure out how I'm feeling and why, and Fi is the supporting function for you, the tool.

  2. #12
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by theDarkSide View Post
    In terms of sensitivity, as far as I've observed, is that ENFP's really don't get into the tiny details of things. Everything is much more in general and put into a larger perspective. The INFP goes deeper into a thought or comment. After a conversation, I'll reflect back on it, too many times (I hate that), and I'll chop up each little sentence and sometimes be able to ascribe 3 meanings to it, and I'll decide how I feel about it, and even when I don't value someone's thoughts, I can still find away to be ticked off about it. Then, I'll get stuck on that one little sentence and have trouble letting go of the implied slight. That's not to say that I always do it, but I have and that's not an ENFP thing. That Ne being your first function makes a big difference as far as not dissecting sentences.
    i think you might be onto something here. i take most things in as examples of a broader thing. i don't get too hung up on any one example, just kind of take it in as a micro-bit of evidence and let work together with all the other things i know. what i take as relevant is whatever broader thing is underlying it. i think that's also why i don't have a very big problem with people being inconsistent. i trust myself to see a broader pattern that isn't shaken up by little variations. that's all Ne. i guess having things pass through that before going to Fi might depersonalize them. or make them less pungent.

    It is strange about ENFP's that they can be outwardly focused and inwardly at the same time. From what I observed, the ENFP was putting all her thoughts and problems out there as in "everyone look at it," and we do, and tell her what we think about it, but she rejects input, or it seems that way. She'd have all these problems that never get solved because she had an idea about how she wanted things to be, and insisted that they were that way (no matter what anyone told her), and therefore, our input was not applicable/invalid because it doesn't fit her vision. So, she would only approach problems in a way that fit her vision of them, which was a fairy tale.
    ok, advocation time lol. ENFPs get accused of this a lot. and i'm no exception. the thing is, we look for a lot of input. and our problems are like life-long projects a lot of the time. constantly being worked out. the looking for input helps us work it out, come up with new ideas and directions to think in, and that's SO valuable. so just because we're not "taking your advice" does not mean we're not using it.
    I accept input and have to come to terms with it. It can be overwhelming if there's too much of it. And I always have so much doubt as to whether my truth is correct and I constantly adjust my worldview to match what's coming in. That's part of why I can be so quiet. I don't want to be stuck in my thoughts, thinking about one stupid sentence, when I'm trying to accomplish stuff.
    yep, i knew what you meant about constantly adjusting your worldview, even if that's not exactly how you meant for it to come out. it's on your mind. you're always working on it, thinking about it in new contexts and in new lights. coming back to old truths or views and reaffirming them. is that accurate?

    I hope none of that was insulting. I don't know what it feels like to be inside the ENFP mind, just what I observed.
    not at all to me. it's really interesting to hear from an INFP on this!

    oh! another thing i just thought of. Te inferior might be a factor as far as INFPs/ENFPs are concerned. with my inferior, i want people to do it for me often. here, organize my room, do my taxes, etc. maybe that's how INFPs view solutions to their problems in some way? like someone poses a strategy and you either take it or you don't. i don't mind flexing my Te, and prefer to strategize my solutions on my own.
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  3. #13
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    I don't consider myself to be easily hurt. I can usually just write potentially hurtful things people say off as their own problem or not very important, and don't get too hung up. As a person who uses Fi, I've often thought Fe users were more easily offended then Fi users (putting more weight into external feelings, etc.)

    Why then are INFPs and ISFPs stereotypically so sensitive? I'm only a function flip away from being INFP. What's the big difference? What am I missing?
    Ach, this is a tough one. In many ways I am super crazy sensitive and in other ways I am totally not.

    Okay, a better way to put this- if I feel like someone who I value says something that negates me and my whole experience, it hurts. If I do something that I know is beautiful and important and no one who matters to me seems to give a shit, it hurts.

    Conversely, if someone who I don't value says something that negates me and my whole experience, I totally blow them off, because why should I care what they think? If I do something that I know is beautiful and important and those I don't value don't give a shit, whatevs.

    Sensitivity, when it comes to IXFPs, however, I think is more about emotional sensitivity in a bigger, more aesthetic way. I see Fi dom as being like a vibrational tuning fork that picks up the emotions given off by everything, and I mean everything, from a tree to a metal desk to the person crossing the street down the block. It's why we little kid IXFPs get weepy about throwing out a smiley face sticker because we feel sorry for the poor little smiley face sticker. (Oh hell, who am I kidding, I still get weepy about shit like this and I know I always will. But hey, I'm cool with that, I like that about myself.)

  4. #14
    As Long As It Takes.... Redbone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    yeah, i was wondering if i was assuming too much saying ENFPs aren't easily hurt. but really, i mean, i can be hurt, but not often by what people say. unless it's already a soft spot for me. but then i go e7 mode and start rationalizing it almost immediately.

    i'm quick to become defensive sometimes (let her put as much bbq sauce as she wants on her damn chicken!). and i can ruminate on things people have said for far too long. but i dunno. i feel really able to think, "that's just your opinion. whatever," most of the time. and if it's something i need to work on, i take it as feedback, and try to use it in a positive way.
    Wow...yes, this so much. I try to protect my sensitive spots but when I get kicked there... I can get hung up on things people say, too. I tend to confront people instead of ruminating on it (it makes my stomach hurt!) but I'm quick to let things go after I've said what I need to. Sensitive spots=things I feel strongly about and not so much my feelings? Or feelings = beliefs.

    I live with two Fi-doms. The INFP is super sensitive. He gets hurt easily and I feel bad for him sometimes because he can find it hard to let things go. Stuff can keep circulating inside in him and he can get into this sinking spiral of depression...it can just feed off itself. The other guy is an ISFP. He's sensitive, too but shakes off things much quicker. He has a strong pragmatic streak and can process negative/bad things quicker.

  5. #15
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    Tertiary Te. I get the impression that it's easier for EFP's to detach from things emotionally, whereas my actions and beliefs are always being put under scrutiny to some extent regardless of mood. At it's worst, it can be painful and nauseating - at it's best, it's grounding and reassuring.

  6. #16
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Sensitivity, when it comes to IXFPs, however, I think is more about emotional sensitivity in a bigger, more aesthetic way. I see Fi dom as being like a vibrational tuning fork that picks up the emotions given off by everything, and I mean everything, from a tree to a metal desk to the person crossing the street down the block. It's why we little kid IXFPs get weepy about throwing out a smiley face sticker because we feel sorry for the poor little smiley face sticker. (Oh hell, who am I kidding, I still get weepy about shit like this and I know I always will. But hey, I'm cool with that, I like that about myself.)
    Oh man, I hear ya. I remember I had a hockey game on N64, and my dad had my favourite player on his team (Paul Kariya), and forced me to trade my second favourite player (Patrick Marleau) to acquire Kariya.

    It was like Sophie's Choice for me. I felt as though I had betrayed Patrick Marleau deeply, and I literally cried myself to sleep, whispering "I'm sorry" all night to the video game version of Patrick Marleau. The guilt of the incident haunted me for years afterwards. Obviously, I don't care anymore, but I still remember what it felt like.

    I think if was a Ne-dom, I would have had way more perspective about the whole thing. Ne has made me infinitely more resilient, adaptable, and easygoing. It lets me see the big picture, rather than just MY FEELINGS ARE THE ONLY THINGS THAT EXIST.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Ach, this is a tough one. In many ways I am super crazy sensitive and in other ways I am totally not.

    Okay, a better way to put this- if I feel like someone who I value says something that negates me and my whole experience, it hurts. If I do something that I know is beautiful and important and no one who matters to me seems to give a shit, it hurts.

    Conversely, if someone who I don't value says something that negates me and my whole experience, I totally blow them off, because why should I care what they think? If I do something that I know is beautiful and important and those I don't value don't give a shit, whatevs.
    Yeah, I think this fits me. I have only ever been called sensitive, and that really breaks surface / I'm keenly aware of it, with intimates (and by early elementary school teachers ). It isn't a trait that others have pointed out to me, i.e. work colleagues, customers. I'm known for being non reactive and even-keeled at work.

    [Well, hmm, with the exception of an xxTJ at work who empathized with my having to run a lot of project meetings in a ridiculous cluster of a situation/project, could see my frustration/stress, and prior to her departure after resigning pulled me aside and encouraged/advised me to let more things go and that I needed to grow a thicker skin in terms of not letting the company / how it operated get to me. Ah, hmm, in essence, my expressions are super easy to read, I have essentially Zero poker face ability, so those who notice (let's say, half or less than half the population) will see something's brewing, but there's not much externally they can latch onto to then call me 'sensitive', as I continue to carry on externally, running meeting, taking care of business, what not.]
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  8. #18
    Problem? Grand Admiral Crunch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    ok, advocation time lol. ENFPs get accused of this a lot. and i'm no exception. the thing is, we look for a lot of input. and our problems are like life-long projects a lot of the time. constantly being worked out. the looking for input helps us work it out, come up with new ideas and directions to think in, and that's SO valuable. so just because we're not "taking your advice" does not mean we're not using it.

    not at all to me. it's really interesting to hear from an INFP on this!

    oh! another thing i just thought of. Te inferior might be a factor as far as INFPs/ENFPs are concerned. with my inferior, i want people to do it for me often. here, organize my room, do my taxes, etc. maybe that's how INFPs view solutions to their problems in some way? like someone poses a strategy and you either take it or you don't. i don't mind flexing my Te, and prefer to strategize my solutions on my own.
    Thanks! Something else about an ENFP - they can really give good compliments, some of the best. I love how ENFP's recognize what's important to another person, understand that thought process, and appreciate the way no one else can. I love ENFP's.

    Glad to know my thoughts on her problems were being taken into consideration. Sometimes I wondered if she'd just brought up her problems for my amusement, so I could feel like I'm in an episode of As the World Turns or some soap opera.

    And yeah, those little things like paying taxes and bills, someone else really should do that for me. I wish I enjoyed those uninspiring things, and then I could be proud that I did them, but I can't.

    Thanks for responding!

  9. #19
    The Dark Lord The Wailing Specter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starry View Post
    7
    I guess that explains a lot. Our psyche drops the pain that ultimately serves no purpose. I know that I go through the grieving process quicker than some people for some things. I look for things that could possibly lighten the mood. I always carry a little sadness with me, though...
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  10. #20
    The Dark Lord The Wailing Specter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbone View Post
    Wow...yes, this so much. I try to protect my sensitive spots but when I get kicked there... I can get hung up on things people say, too. I tend to confront people instead of ruminating on it (it makes my stomach hurt!) but I'm quick to let things go after I've said what I need to. Sensitive spots=things I feel strongly about and not so much my feelings? Or feelings = beliefs.

    I live with two Fi-doms. The INFP is super sensitive. He gets hurt easily and I feel bad for him sometimes because he can find it hard to let things go. Stuff can keep circulating inside in him and he can get into this sinking spiral of depression...it can just feed off itself. The other guy is an ISFP. He's sensitive, too but shakes off things much quicker. He has a strong pragmatic streak and can process negative/bad things quicker.
    I am the same way.
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    I say this as a reminder to myself, but this goes for everyone:

    You can achieve anything you set your mind to, and you are limited only by how dedicated you are to succeed!

    -Magic Qwan

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