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  1. #11
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    I'm very risk averse. I tend to either imagine all the things that could go wrong or imagine what I think it will be like and I'm either underwhelmed or overwhelmed because the experience was nothing like I conceptualized it in my head.

    Even when just I want to do a simple task like go to the store or something, I always conceptualize it in my head before I get up and do it.

  2. #12
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer View Post
    I'm very risk averse. I tend to either imagine all the things that could go wrong or imagine what I think it will be like and I'm either underwhelmed or overwhelmed because the experience was nothing like I conceptualized it in my head. Even when just I want to do a simple task like go to the store or something, I always conceptualize it in my head before I get up and do it.
    Yes, same here. I spent most of my life preconceptualizing situations and avoiding those with risk involved, so I wouldn't lose any ground. (Uggh, I even remember "rehearsing" simple phone calls a few times before making them.)

    It's not a great way to live, and I am moving past it. (Risk is risk; you don't get anywhere without taking some; and I need to trust my ability to flex and compensate for problems as I go, rather than trying to mastermind the perfect approach.)

    I wouldn't ignore the impact of environmental influences on personal development; those who grow up in unstable situations or feel compelled to be "perfect" all the time will be impacted towards self-preservation and potentially risk-avoidance.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  3. #13
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    I'm curious why people are resisting the idea that a J may be more risk tolerant than a P? Is this ingrained into our MBTI psyche that P would be more tolerant of it?

    I think a J may be more risk tolerant because they have more than one plan that they can fall back on, which may relieve some aversion to risk. They may be more prone to actively seek out alternatives if the plan goes awry, and I can see a need for closure forcing a J to make some decisions that make a risk less risky. Basically damage control.

    And personally, risk generally doesn't bother me as long as I think I have time to wiggle myself out of whatever goes wrong. When I jump on things as soon as it goes wrong (if it goes wrong) it tends to work in my favor. It makes me more confident that I can handle a risk when I need to take it, making me less hesitant about risks.
    Last edited by proteanmix; 05-30-2007 at 11:00 AM. Reason: grammar

  4. #14
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I expect things to go wrong, so I make Plans A, B, C, etc. take a deep breath and jump.

    My hubby fears things will go wrong, and compulsively gathers ever more information, trying to make sure Plan A is perfect. If Plan A ever actually gets implemented, the first thing that goes wrong is really hard for him to get over because his perfect plan has been ruined.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  5. #15
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    My hubby fears things will go wrong, and compulsively gathers ever more information, trying to make sure Plan A is perfect. If Plan A ever actually gets implemented, the first thing that goes wrong is really hard for him to get over because his perfect plan has been ruined.
    I empathize with Gruffy. That's what I have usually done too.

    (Although I do have a release valve: If I wear myself down trying too hard to develop Plan A, at some point I will just lose it and throw caution to the wind, jumping in head-first and swimming like mad. The good part is that I have prepared so well trying to get Plan A set up that I actually do have the ability to swim in real-time and make it through the mess, usually... which gives added confidence for the future.)
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  6. #16
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I'm curious why people are resisting the idea that a J may be more risk tolerant than a P? Is this ingrained into our MBTI psyche that P would be more tolerant of it?

    I think a J may be more risk tolerant because they may feel that they may have more than one plan that they can fall back on, which may relieve some aversion to risk. They may be more prone to actively seek out alternatives if the plan goes awry, and I can see a need for closure forcing a J to make some decisions to make that make a risk less risky, basically damage control.

    And personally, risk generalyl doesn't bother me as long as I think I have time to wiggle myself out of whatever goes wrong. When I jump on things as soon as it goes wrong (if it goes wrong) it tends to work in my favor. It makes me more confident that I can handle a risk when I need to take the next one, which makes me less hesitant about taking the next one.
    Js may be less risk-averse because they'd be in a better position to take healthy risks while Ps, after having been forced to pay for their light-hearted attitude towards serious matters actually became less inclined to take risks afterwards. So in the end we still have Js who always took few risks, and yet Ps who are now conditioned to take even less, as unnatural as it may be to them.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

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  7. #17
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by proteanmix View Post
    I'm curious why people are resisting the idea that a J may be more risk tolerant than a P? Is this ingrained into our MBTI psyche that P would be more tolerant of it?
    For me;

    1) It doesn't reflect my own experiences, both in finance and outside of it.

    2) It doesn't mesh up with other research done, which shows pretty much the opposite, consistently, across multiple measures of risk.

    3) The risk assessment they used in that original study is flawed (IMO).

    One of the main reasons is that Ps are generally more risk tolerant in general life decisions - since risk is expressed as change - Ps are generally far more accepting of change than Js.

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    Hmm. I'm generally more comfortable with risk-taking and change than my INTP partner is.
    Yeah I find INFJs have more risk tolerance than INTPs as well. I'm not sure as to why it's the case but it's something I've observed in my small sample size of people I know well. 3 INFJs, 4 INTPs.

    Additionally, I find ENFPs to just as many "risky" things as an ENTP - but sometimes, I feel like they aren't always aware of the risk. Often, I get the sense their inate optimism leads them to believe things are going to work out for them (without believing the risk is there).

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by cafe View Post
    I expect things to go wrong, so I make Plans A, B, C, etc. take a deep breath and jump.

    My hubby fears things will go wrong, and compulsively gathers ever more information, trying to make sure Plan A is perfect. If Plan A ever actually gets implemented, the first thing that goes wrong is really hard for him to get over because his perfect plan has been ruined.
    Is your husband an INTP? I found the same thing when I had a startup with an ENTJ and an INTP. The INTP got really crazy when there were some bad indicators in the first month of launch. The ENTJs, I've worked it showed more risk tolerance than the INTP as well.

    It may have something to do with Extroverts having a higher stimulus overload threshold (but that wouldn't explain why the INFJs I know exhibit more risk prone behavior).

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by meanlittlechimp View Post
    It may have something to do with Extroverts having a higher stimulus overload threshold (but that wouldn't explain why the INFJs I know exhibit more risk prone behavior).
    I think you can credit part of it to the philosophical differences between all the J's you describe and the INTP mentality.

    INTPs hate to impose on the process and/or fight against the flow of things. They go WITH the flow instead and try to find the inherent pattern within. One of the reasons I think INTPs isolate themselves in order to preserve their autonomy is because they have TROUBLE fighting against the impositions of others; to not interfere with others, yet to preserve their autonomy, they withdraw.

    The J's you mention exert themselves in order to implement control and have confidence that their efforts are allowable AND effective. They tend to not have as much issue with simply overriding other things.

    INTPs also "predict" the future state of something by how it seems to logically work in the past, plus its current state. The INTP cannot interfere with the machine, they simply observe the machine and predict its state; this is the detached third-party observer effect. And if the INTP sees that the outcome is probably negative, they will simply try a different strategy if possible, rather than engaging the problem and trying to change the parameters or just changing things through sheer force of energy and will. If they CAN'T find an effective strategy, they would rather not engage at all because all paths seem fraught with failure.

    J's and SPs seem much more inclined to change the situation by exerting control/energy over it. NTJs will strategize first, but will still Te their way through it.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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