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  1. #81
    Happy Dancer uumlau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stansmith View Post
    The idea that bounciness/constant body moment = dominant Pe seems a bit misleading though. Fiona Apple and Andrew Garfield (INFPs) strike me as somewhat bouncy and jittery at times, although obviously, not to the same extent as someone like Katy Perry or Quentin Tarantino.
    I was typed as Se(Fi/Te)Ni by this system, using the video I posted a long while ago on the videos thread. The person doing the typing sees all of the bouncing in motion of my presentation implies dominant Se. The problem I have with that interpretation is that it was a presentation. I had a very specific set of things I was going to say, a very specific amount of time I was going to say it in, and I wanted it to be at least marginally entertaining (so people might watch the whole thing, instead of stopping 2 minutes in due to sheer boredom). There was about 2-3 hours of planning, preparation of props, etc., and even then I wasn't entirely satisfied with the result.

    In other words, I believe my Ni dominance was hidden: that it is what made the whole video appear to be easy, effortless and spontaneous.

    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I was looking at their website and I was thinking of all of the reasons that would cause a person to be typed as more extroverted vs introverted by their method. First, if you're talking to a friend or recording yourself on your laptop you're going to be more expressive than if you're being interviewed by a stranger- that's just how it is. (or if it's a stranger you get along with you might seem more extroverted vs someone you don't connect with.) Also, I think there are plenty of introverts who extrovert in a 'weird' way which is going to make them seem more extroverted- like Robert Pattinson, as you say. I think a true extrovert will seem less awkward when extroverting, and it will be more consistent. With Pattinson it seems more sporadic- bursts of extroversion. It's kind of like all of the comedians who act wild and crazy but off stage are quiet and reserved. (Or in Spiderman 3 when Spidey gets all awkwardly extroverted and everyone looks at him like he's insane.)

    I think it might be possible to determine the cognitive functions used by this method, but I think it would be more difficult to determine the order. There's just way too many variables.
    I think you might be on to something, here. I suspect that the visual typing works to figure out which axis of N/S and T/F is present, but it can be misleading, especially with respect to videos that are expressing, perhaps, one's inferior or auxiliary.

    Interestingly, (MBTI-knowledgeable) people have watched videos of my salsa dancing and said, "It is sooo obvious you are an INTJ when you dance." Why? An Se dom moves his whole body, everything is moving with the music, following beats that you wouldn't even hear except his body movements point them out to you. I don't do that: my movements tend to stay very smooth and controlled, and my gaze stares off into space. As one ESFP dance teacher told me, "HEY! Look at me! Look at your partner." I have to make a conscious effort to do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Well it definitely seems like most people on the ct forum don't heed that advice, at least. I really wanted to approach it with an open mind but-

    Patti Smith and Leonard Cohen TeNi? Bob Dylan TiSe? I see stuff like that and feel no reason to pay attention.
    The main one I disagreed with (back when I was reviewing them several months ago) was Alanis Morisette as INTP, when she vibes to me the same way most INFPs do, never mind the INFP nature of her music. I suspect the person doing that reading is reading her smiles wrong, as Fe instead of Fi. Perhaps she genetically has a smile that looks Fe.

    Also, I suspect that we tend to latch on to one of the two axes more quickly than the other, and try to make the other fit. Most people would start off typing her as NF (due to her music and personality), spot the obvious Ne, and then say INFP, or instead see her as more introspective and lean toward INFJ. The visual typing instead starts off spotting the very obvious Ne, plus the introversion, and is thus stuck choosing between INFP and INTP, and her smile is more typical of Fe. (Again, I think it's more that may very well be genetic, and not an unconscious expression of Fe.)

    That would indicate two potential flaws of the visual typing system. 1) people temporarily expressing their inferior side, and 2) people with facial expressions that genetically resemble the cues for a type in most other people, but not the case in hand.
    An argument is two people sharing their ignorance.

    A discussion is two people sharing their understanding, even when they disagree.

  2. #82
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    Just because you see something doesn't mean it's the reality.

    Why? Because people see what they choose to see!

    We tend to see things in terms of confirmation biases.

    If we're conditioned to think this expression means that function in all cases, then the exceptions may not be detected.

    Sometimes people aren't even acting naturally; they're just going through premeditated processes.

  3. #83
    Member chaoticbrain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    Well it definitely seems like most people on the ct forum don't heed that advice, at least. I really wanted to approach it with an open mind but-

    Patti Smith and Leonard Cohen TeNi? Bob Dylan TiSe? I see stuff like that and feel no reason to pay attention.
    Well I haven't seen the thread for Patti Smith, but I vaguely remember her being a type which was incredibly hard to tell from her polar and therefore we didn't draw a definite conclusion ? Which might be why we don't list her here.

    http://www.pinterest.com/filippomeda...ognitivetypes/

    As for Bob Dylan, what about him doesn't seem TiSe ? He very much has the TiSe "I'm a badass" vibes.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaoticbrain View Post

    As for Bob Dylan, what about him doesn't seem TiSe ? He very much has the TiSe "I'm a badass" vibes.
    I cannot tell you how much Fi doms, especially when heterosexual male, feel the need to cover the sensitivity with a badass vibe.

  5. #85
    Member chaoticbrain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brainheart View Post
    I cannot tell you how much Fi doms, especially when heterosexual male, feel the need to cover the sensitivity with a badass vibe.
    I don't think sensitivity is necessarily related to being Fi-lead, but one thing to keep in mind, is that my impression of him being TiSe was just based on looking at him for a bit, I'm not 100% sure. It's possible he's an Fi-lead lacking tension.

    Edit: actually not he's 100% TiSe through CT method.

    Fe polar smile (doesn't go high up on the face



    TiSe "I'm so awesome".


  6. #86
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    I'm not sure if anyone has commented on this yet... but the Fi vs Fe smile: I'm not sure I can fully agree. I don't think it's a fully reliable method to rule out Fi from Fe. I think we look like we're snarling when we're trying to hold back or hide our smile/emotion. But in times where we don't feel the need to hide or hold back, the smile is more full, extending to the ears.
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    I only know flawed people who are still worth loving."
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  7. #87
    Member chaoticbrain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IndyAnnaJoan View Post
    I'm not sure if anyone has commented on this yet... but the Fi vs Fe smile: I'm not sure I can fully agree. I don't think it's a fully reliable method to rule out Fi from Fe. I think we look like we're snarling when we're trying to hold back or hide our smile/emotion. But in times where we don't feel the need to hide or hold back, the smile is more full, extending to the ears.
    Check out my post half way down the page.

    http://cognitivetype.boards.net/thread/282/fi-tension

    Keen observation on your part . But it's Fe user trying to hide their smile that actually looks like Fi snarl. I actually haven't seen anyone besides myself that's like that though. o.o So it's kind of rare and I haven't seen it confuse things.

  8. #88
    Senior Member IndyGhost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaoticbrain View Post
    Check out my post half way down the page.

    http://cognitivetype.boards.net/thread/282/fi-tension

    Keen observation on your part . But it's Fe user trying to hide their smile that actually looks like Fi snarl. I actually haven't seen anyone besides myself that's like that though. o.o So it's kind of rare and I haven't seen it confuse things.
    Perhaps it's both types. In general, the desire to hide a smile comes out as a snarl.
    "I don't know a perfect person.
    I only know flawed people who are still worth loving."
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  9. #89
    brainheart
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    Quote Originally Posted by chaoticbrain View Post
    I don't think sensitivity is necessarily related to being Fi-lead, but one thing to keep in mind, is that my impression of him being TiSe was just based on looking at him for a bit, I'm not 100% sure. It's possible he's an Fi-lead lacking tension.

    Edit: actually not he's 100% TiSe through CT method.

    Fe polar smile (doesn't go high up on the face



    TiSe "I'm so awesome".

    Well, your method is free to make any conclusions it wants but I'm going to disagree, both with the methods and the conclusions.

  10. #90
    Senior Member Sanjuro's Avatar
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    I think there's something to this, actually. I remember in the 7th grade we discussed metacognition, and how different processes are linked to different eye movements--visual looks up, audio looks sideways, kinesthetic looks down. Stuff like that.

    So, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that different cognitive processes were related to different eye movements and/or expressions. I'm not sure I buy it wholesale, since there are many cultural and other factors that could play into this, and some people seemed to be mistyped by this method (Hitler was no ENTJ). But, I think it's worthy of exploration.

    In my own case, I have witnessed a lot of what they claim is Ne/Si and Te/Fi in the videos I've shot of myself (poor quality lighting and poor quality cameras cause me to reserve judgement at present, though), which are the axes I'm most identified with. I haven't seen the "pained" INFP expression, though, unless I'm deliberately emoting.

    I'd like to compare INFP and ENFP, though, so I hope they update soon!!

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