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  1. #1
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Default I want to translate the cognitive functions.

    I'm trying to get a good handle on all the cognitive functions. I've come up with a couple words that can be closely associated with the functions as I understand them. If I'm way off, let me know. Let me know which ones are spot on, too.


    Te = facts, investigation, function
    Ti = logic, analysis
    Ne = possibilities, potential
    Ni= imagination
    Si = the experience,aesthetics
    Se = maneuvering, situational power and presence
    Fe = preference/ emotional "energy" broadcasts and frequencies,empathy
    Fi = personal preferences,ethics, wishes
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  2. #2
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    i wouldnt agree with those definitions(too broad, trying to put things that are unrelated to some function etc). also this sort of approach isnt what functions are about, functions are about gathering information(P functions) and processing that information(J functions), not about wishes, ethics and that sort of stuff. not to mention that you are making way too big of a distinction between introverted and extraverted function attitudes. the I and E version is just a different approach to the same function.

    Quote Originally Posted by http://www.nyaap.org/jung-lexicon/o
    In Jung’s model of typology, a thinking attitude is oriented by the principle of logic; a sensation attitude is oriented by the direct perception of concrete facts; intuition orients itself to future possibilities; and feeling is governed by subjective worth. Each of these attitudes may operate in an introverted or extraverted way.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  3. #3
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    i wouldnt agree with those definitions(too broad, trying to put things that are unrelated to some function etc). also this sort of approach isnt what functions are about, functions are about gathering information(P functions) and processing that information(J functions), not about wishes, ethics and that sort of stuff. not to mention that you are making way too big of a distinction between introverted and extraverted function attitudes. the I and E version is just a different approach to the same function.
    Interesting. I would say I wasn't so much trying to define the functions as provide "metaphors" for them. They're not meant as strict definitions, but rather "you could think of the functions like this."

    Nonetheless, it seems like i got sensation wrong.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

    Visit my Johari:
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  4. #4
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    Interesting. I would say I wasn't so much trying to define the functions as provide "metaphors" for them. They're not meant as strict definitions, but rather "you could think of the functions like this."

    Nonetheless, it seems like i got sensation wrong.
    "A sensation attitude is oriented by the direct perception of concrete facts." A fact isn't a perceived fact until it has first been judged a fact. So I would be careful about picking up little tidbits from webpages, they often reflect the personalities and cognitive styles of those creating them. That's why you see so many type descriptions biased by NT and NF, the types most interested in exploring this topic.

    "Te = facts, investigation, function
    Ti = logic, analysis
    Ne = possibilities, potential
    Ni= imagination
    Si = the experience,aesthetics
    Se = maneuvering, situational power and presence
    Fe = preference/ emotional "energy" broadcasts and frequencies,empathy
    Fi = personal preferences,ethics, wishes"

    I don't think these are too far off. Your ideas about Se and Si are, as you've already noted, pretty out of whack. Si prefers concrete symbols and mythology. Se anticipates an experience, enjoys it, and then moves on to the next experience. Se is the most "in the moment" function.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  5. #5
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    Interesting. I would say I wasn't so much trying to define the functions as provide "metaphors" for them. They're not meant as strict definitions, but rather "you could think of the functions like this."

    Nonetheless, it seems like i got sensation wrong.
    Well i dont think you can think of the functions like that, because thats not what functions are :P . But the Si part was pretty close, when sensation is introverted, its the strength of the aesthetic qualities of sensation that is the determining factor, not the strength of the sensory information(as it is in Se). This doesent mean that Se users dont experience aesthetics, but its just not the thing for them which determines where thinking or feeling is directed. Equally Si users do see sensory information(but are not so often consciously processing it as Se users are), but the sensory information itself isnt what guides consciousness. You see Si users are Ne users and are more interested about the possibilities which are inherit in the sensory information, rather than looking simply 'what is' in front of them.

    pretty common definitions for functions(which were said by jung somewhere and was said in our personality psychology class) are that:

    sensation tells that a thing is(trough sensory perception ofc)
    thinking tells what the thing is(logical analysis)
    feeling tells what the thing is worth and whether it is acceptable or not(subjective reflection of its worth)
    intuitions tells where the thing came from and where it is going to(perception of possibilities via unconscious)
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  6. #6
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Something you need to remember is that introversion is like the meta version of the raw extroverted function.

    I took some notes on this last night, actually. I was pretty pleased.

    Ne:
    Expression of ideas. Seizing and illuminating the unseen, drawing connections, determining possibilities. Contrasting the existing context.
    Danger: too much novelty for its own sake. Ridiculousness. Too far out of context, or hostile toward accepted context. Seen as weird and/or aggressive.

    Ni:
    A big picture focus on the human mind itself, how it thinks and sees things, what its boundaries and capabilities are, how it responds to circumstances. How have ideas evolved over time and how have they stayed the same? How do perspectives change? How does the present manifest this? What are the things people tend to think of?
    Danger: Insanity by going too far gone down the rabbit hole of the mind; disconnection from physical world.

    Te:
    Actively applying impersonal logic to the outer world. Managing, measuring, building, applying facts and theories. Making and following rules.
    Danger: Inhumanity; treating people as objects with no regard to feelings; coldness; overly driven to succeed

    Ti:
    Understanding that all of the systems of history were nothing more than layers on pure physical reality. Examining the absolute, timeless reality that underlies all man made systems, measurements, and rules. Analysis of the big picture, categorization. Application of timeless principles of logic.
    Danger: Excessive deconstruction that leads to paralysis, falling out of context of society, excessive practicality.

    Se:
    Literally notice raw physical details and their possibilities for expression. Feeling and experimenting with physical sensations. Creating a viscerally striking image, either with their own body or as a separate work of art. Noting the way the environment appears.
    Danger: Superficiality, excessive image, impulsive recklessness, hedonism.

    Si:
    Notice whether the physical environment conforms to expectations. How does the present environment connect to the past? Creating standards to expect. Noting when things are out of standard context or out of place. Making the world more like the well accepted standard.
    Danger: stuck in the past, stuck in old ways of thought, inability to change with the times.

    Fe:
    Displaying culturally defined outward behaviors of inclusion and exclusion. Demonstrating interpersonal value in culturally defined ways. Weddings, ceremonies, parties, holidays, participation in organizations, following trends, etc.
    Danger: Hollowness. Grand, empty displays of social importance that render the feelings involved invisible and go far, far beyond practicality.

    Fi:
    Realizing the timeless interpersonal connection that exists at the heart of the myriad cultural displays of interpersonal value. Finding the true feelings of other people that transcend cultural manifestations and experiences.
    Danger: Softness, defeatism, inaction caused by unwillingness to maintain professional distance.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Mal12345's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Something you need to remember is that introversion is like the meta version of the raw extroverted function.

    I took some notes on this last night, actually. I was pretty pleased.

    Ne:
    Expression of ideas. Seizing and illuminating the unseen, drawing connections, determining possibilities. Contrasting the existing context.
    Danger: too much novelty for its own sake. Ridiculousness. Too far out of context, or hostile toward accepted context. Seen as weird and/or aggressive.

    Ni:
    A big picture focus on the human mind itself, how it thinks and sees things, what its boundaries and capabilities are, how it responds to circumstances. How have ideas evolved over time and how have they stayed the same? How do perspectives change? How does the present manifest this? What are the things people tend to think of?
    Danger: Insanity by going too far gone down the rabbit hole of the mind; disconnection from physical world.

    Te:
    Actively applying impersonal logic to the outer world. Managing, measuring, building, applying facts and theories. Making and following rules.
    Danger: Inhumanity; treating people as objects with no regard to feelings; coldness; overly driven to succeed

    Ti:
    Understanding that all of the systems of history were nothing more than layers on pure physical reality. Examining the absolute, timeless reality that underlies all man made systems, measurements, and rules. Analysis of the big picture, categorization. Application of timeless principles of logic.
    Danger: Excessive deconstruction that leads to paralysis, falling out of context of society, excessive practicality.

    Se:
    Literally notice raw physical details and their possibilities for expression. Feeling and experimenting with physical sensations. Creating a viscerally striking image, either with their own body or as a separate work of art. Noting the way the environment appears.
    Danger: Superficiality, excessive image, impulsive recklessness, hedonism.

    Si:
    Notice whether the physical environment conforms to expectations. How does the present environment connect to the past? Creating standards to expect. Noting when things are out of standard context or out of place. Making the world more like the well accepted standard.
    Danger: stuck in the past, stuck in old ways of thought, inability to change with the times.
    Nobody gets Si right on this forum.
    "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth." Mike Tyson
    “Culture?” says Paul McCartney. “This isn't culture. It's just a good laugh.”

  8. #8
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    That's awesome. I make a brilliant post and all anyone has to offer is some nitpick that probably isn't even based on anything. Sometimes I hate.

  9. #9
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    I'm trying to get a good handle on all the cognitive functions. I've come up with a couple words that can be closely associated with the functions as I understand them. If I'm way off, let me know. Let me know which ones are spot on, too.


    Te = facts, investigation, function
    Ti = logic, analysis
    Ne = possibilities, potential
    Ni= imagination
    Si = the experience,aesthetics
    Se = maneuvering, situational power and presence
    Fe = preference/ emotional "energy" broadcasts and frequencies,empathy
    Fi = personal preferences,ethics, wishes
    These are ok, I like Se and Fe especially. I would like to add efficiency to Te...but that's just me...to me that would sum up Te in total...In a literal sense too...Someone with Te can take a 10 page paper and consolidate it into 2 paragraghs.

    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    That's awesome. I make a brilliant post and all anyone has to offer is some nitpick that probably isn't even based on anything. Sometimes I hate.
    The things you have on Ni are pretty awesome
    "Once the game is over, the Pawn and the King go back into the same box"

    Freedom isn't free.
    "Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear." ~ Orwell
    I'm that person that embodies pretty much everything that you hate. Might as well get used to it.
    Unapologetically bonding in an uninhibited, propelled manner
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  10. #10
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Something you need to remember is that introversion is like the meta version of the raw extroverted function.

    I took some notes on this last night, actually. I was pretty pleased.

    Ne:
    Expression of ideas. Seizing and illuminating the unseen, drawing connections, determining possibilities. Contrasting the existing context.
    Danger: too much novelty for its own sake. Ridiculousness. Too far out of context, or hostile toward accepted context. Seen as weird and/or aggressive.



    Ti:
    Understanding that all of the systems of history were nothing more than layers on pure physical reality. Examining the absolute, timeless reality that underlies all man made systems, measurements, and rules. Analysis of the big picture, categorization. Application of timeless principles of logic.
    Danger: Excessive deconstruction that leads to paralysis, falling out of context of society, excessive practicality.

    Fe:
    Displaying culturally defined outward behaviors of inclusion and exclusion. Demonstrating interpersonal value in culturally defined ways. Weddings, ceremonies, parties, holidays, participation in organizations, following trends, etc.
    Danger: Hollowness. Grand, empty displays of social importance that render the feelings involved invisible and go far, far beyond practicality.
    Ne and Ti are very good. However, I don't agree with the emphasis on cultural convention for Fi. I know someone who is an IXFJ that's in a polyamorous relationship. That's most definitely not a cultural convention.

    Quote Originally Posted by Urarienev View Post
    These are ok, I like Se and Fe especially. I would like to add efficiency to Te...but that's just me...to me that would sum up Te in total...In a literal sense too...Someone with Te can take a 10 page paper and consolidate it into 2 paragraghs.

    I didn't include efficency, because I felt it covered by functionality. Efficiency has to do with how well something works. Fe was tricky. I found "values" to be too damn vauge, so I was trying to find something else to use.

    Apparently, my description of Fi is off, however. That doesn't surprise me, because I usually can't make sense of it myself.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


    This is not going to go the way you think....

    Visit my Johari:
    http://kevan.org/johari?name=Birddude78

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