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  1. #101
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    I would like to add to my initial answe...

    I am friends with a lot of ISFJs. That is probably the most Fe I have experience with. If I had to generalize, as I group I would say they are so sweet and fun and funny, and you just feel like they have got your back. They are happy when everyone's having a good time and they do everything in their power to help things to run smoothly and for everyone to feel comfortable.

    Look! I got you these pita chips because I know you love them! Now we can dip them in hummus.

    Mmmm.

    I remembered it is your birthday and I made this card for you and I remembered to mail it so it would get there in time.


    sooooo... there's that
    Your kisses, sweeter than honey. But guess what, so is my money.

  2. #102
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Standuble View Post
    This seems to be confirming the assertion AA made as well as my thoughts on the matter. The ENFJ seemed to have access to two environments if I'm not mistaken - a primary one which promoted that racial diversity was good and the campus. If the campus was the lesser of the two it would be classified as deficient and then subject to alteration so it became more like the primary (which sees racial diversity as morally right.) If this is true then it doesn't challenge AA's statement - Had an environment which lacked diversity been his only ethical construct he wouldn't have battered an eyelid, let alone sought to change it.
    That doesn't make any more sense to me than saying Te can't look at a disorganized mess and see a good method of rearranging it unless it's already been exposed to it. I do see what you mean but Ni and Si make it possible for the Fe user to see new ways of structuring their environments in their mind's eye.

  3. #103
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    I'll believe that when I see it.
    Send me your addeess and credit card info and I'll ship you a benevolent Fe dom for only 5 easy payments of $29.99!

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    Send me your addeess and credit card info and I'll ship you a benevolent Fe dom for only 5 easy payments of $29.99!
    Are you saying that Fe doms are whores?

  5. #105
    Glycerine
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    I like the idea of Skylights being our madam.

  6. #106
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    I'll acquire @Glycerine for 5 payments of $29.99, but I demand free shipping to Brazil.
    -----------------

    A man builds. A parasite asks 'Where is my share?'
    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


    -----------------

  7. #107
    Riva
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    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeAppled View Post
    Wait a second, where's Riva?

    I love, Riva, how you just start a Fe/Fi thread knowinbg full well it will balloon quickly & have plenty of contention in it, and then just sort of walk away, probably laughing your ass off at the mess it will make. Things must have been getting still around here, or that INFJ/INFP thread has been too peaceful.

    You're soooo Ne! You're my hero for the next 23 minutes, Riva.
    Haha.

    At the risk of knowing that you would retract that hug (which I have never recalled you using before) I must confess that it wasn’t my intention at all. I tease people all the time (especially in RL) for giggles but seldom (actually never) exploit a person’s anger to achieve this. It just doesn't feel right.

    I usually tease people by accusing them about the most obvious things that are not true of them or by suggestions on doing things to gain sadistic or promiscuous pleasures etc. Most of them are lame but some of them hit the target and then I carry on. People know by instinct that the game I am playing is to annoy them and that if they do get angry I win. So they try hard very hard to not get angry. And people are seldom angered by me in RL. On forums of course …..

    However I am capable of angering someone whom I am disgusted with.

    And I didn’t follow the INFP/INFJ thread but did so after you mentioned it.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBaby View Post
    Preference would have been to 'nothing at all'. imo, the OP was just bait - better not to bite.
    No. My intention was to do exactly –

    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    Opinion Shmopinion. Title is requesting something nice if possible. Would it have been so hard to just say something nice or nothing at all?
    ^ This and also to imply,

    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    but now I'm just sick of the irrational Fe hate.
    This.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    I actually prefer to wrangle with an Fe dom who is overbearing and simply hide from them, or "yeah yeah yeah" them and run away
    +1

    Just as much as someone would hide from a Te dom.

    I must add,

    There is a reason for everything (I believe) though however insane or unfair it might sound to another.

    In unhealthy Te it is either when they believe they are absolutely right/logical or when it is self serving. If it is self serving (and believe me Te could be ectremely self serving) it is easier to reject them (unless he is in a authoritative position like a boss or a team mate or a colleague etc) and more reason to deny their attempts but if he is under the impression that what he is doing is right/flawlessly-logical then you have a problem. In these circumstances one should have the patience/guts to put forward one’s own point of views and indicate why one believes that the other isn’t correct.

    This is similar to the issues seen in unhealthy Fe. It is more or less the same. (Either that person believes he is correct or has a self serving agenda.) Either way it could be dealt with the same way one would deal with Fe. But I do realize that for some this isn’t easy and in some circumstances it is almost impossible to deal with it but the issues faced are similar.

    However before making it an issue it is better to find the cause – whether it is self serving or not.

  8. #108
    Sugar Hiccup OrangeAppled's Avatar
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    ^ I think the thread would've gotten better results if simply entitled "Fi types - what do you like about Fe?". Something about the title makes you want to explain why you may have some irritation with Fe users instead of what you like about some Fe users.

    P.S. @Riva I still think you're Ne-dom.
    Often a star was waiting for you to notice it. A wave rolled toward you out of the distant past, or as you walked under an open window, a violin yielded itself to your hearing. All this was mission. But could you accomplish it? (Rilke)

    INFP | 4w5 sp/sx | RLUEI - Primary Inquisitive | Tritype is tripe

  9. #109
    i love skylights's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bologna View Post
    Are you saying that Fe doms are whores?
    Quote Originally Posted by Glycerine View Post
    I like the idea of Skylights being our madam.


    Pay increase of 25% for both of you.

    @Rasofy, you can have your shipping fee back upon return of Gylcerine safe and sound (provided she is in accordance with the arrangement).

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra
    I just think many of y'all (not all, tho) are excessively concerned with lame in-group/out-group dynamics.

    (but, once again, I don't think Fi-users are immune to this, per the FP hipster example.)

    I just think Fe-users often tend to be more concerned with that stuff than Fi users.

    It's like a matrix that Fe users seem highly connected to, that Fi users do not.
    I think someone - OA maybe? - brought up that there is some overlap/confusion between Fe and the Social instinct variant. I think it's an excellent point, because they can come off similarly even though they orient differently. As far as I understand, So is a mechanism that identifies collective contexts, determines individual place in those contexts, and assists in optimizing one's position. This includes "in" and "out", as well as the million shades of gray in between, and "normal" and "abnormal". Then we have Fe, which is a thinking process of seeking to establish external order by creating value-based priorities and goals. Because Fe prioritizes in terms of external order, it is likely to be able to "feel" the in/out and accepted/unaccepted that are part of external social structure, though the lower-So Fe user probably doesn't place much importance on their personal place within groups beyond appropriate contribution (for example, my Sp-first ESFJ mom, who is very attentive to whether everyone is enjoying themselves and how to reorganize people for a more pleasant experience, but doesn't care much about her own position in the group), while the Fi dom/aux So-first may place much importance on their position in the collective, but not feel the need to influence external structure beyond their personal mobilization (for example, my INFP So-first hipster friend who self-defines in large part by choosing which music groups, coffeehouses, art movements, and social collectives she identifies with and which ones she does not, but is not interested in influencing others' individual behavior).

    I suspect (anyone please correct me if I am wrong) that there can be a degree of frustration that accompanies a strong Fe user or So first/second observing someone who is "weird" to the extent that it creates problems for themself as well as social discord amongst others. Even as a strong Fi user I cringe around certain people who seem to have a native gift for being painfully awkward to a point where it is disruptive to everyone. I think there is a definite consciousness, though, for how purposeful/intentional it is. I have a family member who is very non-neurotypical, who tends to physically get too close when talking, ask poorly-timed questions, and switches subjects at his whims, and the Fe users of the family are some of the best at welcoming him and periodically redirecting him to make things easier for himself and everyone else. They don't seem to hold his unintentional weirdness against him - though they do make value judgments on harmful behavior that he could control but chooses not to, because that unnecessarily disrupts the external harmony that would otherwise be achieved. While Fi tends to assume live and let live, Fe is much more attuned to how each person's behavior influences the collective for better or for worse.

    So - like you said, Z - it's a matrix that some are connected to more strongly than others. I think whether it's used in a self-serving manner or not, though, is very individual. I think that there is also a grain of truth to not taking those labels at a Fi level, because they may not be static character judgments but instead willful behavior judgments, as is more applicable on the Fe plane.

  10. #110
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by digesthisickness View Post
    Opinion Shmopinion. Title is requesting something nice if possible. Would it have been so hard to just say something nice or nothing at all?
    yes. I always make it a point to make my opinion of someone/something known, even though, as you could see from my post, I also have some nicer things to say.
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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