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  1. #1
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Default What is healthy/unhealthy?

    Hi
    A few days ago I've read a thread about the characters from malcolm in the middle. Someone typed Lois as ESTJ or maybe as an unhealthy ESFJ.
    I didn't get what that means and I couldn't find anything on the internet. Can someone give me a quick explanation, please?

  2. #2
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    I think people tend to put in their own definitions.

    Id say for me unhealthy tends to mean someone who is completely mired in their personalities without any self-awareness whatsoever. The more extreme the worst, as the individual is literally unable to perceive themselves in a balanced manner.

    Anything and everything is used as an excuse to project self-revelation and blame elsewhere. The controlling spouse is only 'looking out for your best interests' the abusive friend is only doing things 'that you made me do'.

    There is a lot more to this but I don't want to write an essay. Besides we are all guilty of this to some extent, it is just how big of an extent.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  3. #3
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    it tends to mean "I don't like them" more often than not.
    -end of thread-

  4. #4
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    I think people tend to put in their own definitions.

    Id say for me unhealthy tends to mean someone who is completely mired in their personalities without any self-awareness whatsoever. The more extreme the worst, as the individual is literally unable to perceive themselves in a balanced manner.

    Anything and everything is used as an excuse to project self-revelation and blame elsewhere. The controlling spouse is only 'looking out for your best interests' the abusive friend is only doing things 'that you made me do'.

    There is a lot more to this but I don't want to write an essay. Besides we are all guilty of this to some extent, it is just how big of an extent.
    Ok, so someone who has developed many bad manners of a personality is unhealthy?

    Edit: I just found this: http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/intro.asp#instincts

    Healthy
    Level 1
    The Level of Liberation
    Level 2
    The Level of Psychological Capacity
    Level 3
    The Level of Social Value

    Average
    Level 4
    The Level of Imbalance/ Social Role
    Level 5
    The Level of Interpersonal Control
    Level 6
    The Level of Overcompensation

    Unhealthy
    Level 7
    The Level of Violation
    Level 8
    The Level of Obsession and Compulsion
    Level 9
    The Level of Pathological Destructiveness

  5. #5
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randomnity View Post
    it tends to mean "I don't like them" more often than not.
    Unfortunately so. Ironically doing that is a sign of an unhealthy individual, looking for something to pin their anguish on.

    Quote Originally Posted by Infperson View Post
    Ok, so someone who has developed many bad manners of a personality is unhealthy?
    I don't know about bad manners, I was just giving my view on it, but your link is interesting and of more use than my personalised definition, which in itself is an ironic construct designed to protect one, (me), from self-revelation.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  6. #6
    Senior Member UniqueMixture's Avatar
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    Someone who has behavior that is destructive to themselves or others. If she is estj then her behavior is deemed by the person somewhat acceptable because estjs are "not supposed to" be aware of how they come across to others or somesuch whereas for an esfj that would be less acceptable because they are "supposed to know better" would be my guess.
    For all that we have done, as a civilization, as individuals, the universe is not stable, and nor is any single thing within it. Stars consume themselves, the universe itself rushes apart, and we ourselves are composed of matter in constant flux. Colonies of cells in temporary alliance, replicating and decaying and housed within, an incandescent cloud of electrical impulses. This is reality, this is self knowledge, and the perception of it will, of course, make you dizzy.

  7. #7
    Infinite Bubble
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    I'm unsure if this is what you are looking for:

    Whoever was typing Lois was obviously using the dichotomies rather than cognitive functions. When someone transforms into the unhealthy version of their type, they begin to use their inferior and shadow functions more. So a Thinker may act more like a Feeler because that function will be lower in their stacking. So when they said ESTJ or unhealthy ESFJ, they meant that she could in fact be an F but be acting more T due to unhealthiness. Except they would be wrong because ESTJ's have Te/Fi and ESFJ's Ti/Fe. An unhealthy ESFJ would use Ne and Ti more (in an immature way because they are undeveloped). There are also tertiary loops where one ignores their auxiliary and become reliant on Dom & Tert functions which is a horrible place to be in because they both have the same orientation (Intro/Extroverted), and one needs both otherwise disorders can develop.

  8. #8
    Almöhi Stephano's Avatar
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    @Infinite Bubble
    Thx a lot, i think this is what the poster meant. I found the thread again. http://www.typologycentral.com/forums/popular-culture-type/18809-malcolm-middle-3.html


    Could it be that I'm a little unhealthy, I used to score INFP on tests for several years. I had moderate-high feeling, but now I score close to F/T border. Is it possible that my personality changed or is it just a phase?

  9. #9
    Infinite Bubble
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    Are you under stress at the present time? Where you healthier when scoring as INFP or now?

    There are conflicting theories about whether or not your type can actually change. Personally, I think it can fluctuate during the course of your life. Remember that there are other variables that can be perceived as your type changing e.g. development of other functions, stress, hormones etc. I think that you will always have a natural tendency to some functions which is why the majority of people keep their type throughout their life. So it could be a phase now, or maybe it was a phase back then.

  10. #10
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    We all tend to automatically repress the functions that contradict the conscious point of view, those functions are inferior and tert to a lesser degree. This repression is what makes the functions unconscious, but nevertheless they are there and are guiding your behavior to some degree. When the situation would strongly need the usage of the unconscious functions, they might erupt from the unconscious in uncontrollable ways(especially if there has been some pressure on the function than havent found a proper vent), leading to this unhealthy behavior.

    Thats why its good to develop your tert and inferior, so that you can find the correct ways of adjusting to different situations and do it consciously, not let your inferior go into some rampage and cause all sorts of shit you wouldnt normally want to cause.

    When speaking of unhealthy individual in terms of typology, its the kind of person that easily uses some undeveloped function and cant control it and thus causing all sorts of unhealthy shit to himself and/or others
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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