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  1. #171
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    I didn't single them out. TGO claimed that if greenfairy were an NT, she would have been able to handle his comment without flying off the handle.

    It's here:
    http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...=1#post2126343

    My post was made to refute TGO's claim, and nothing more.
    Clearly, you misunderstood my reason for posting.
    Clearly I did. If your goal was simply to show that NTs can fly off the handle like anyone else, why mention specifically women? Do women NTs fly off the handle more than men, or less than men, or in a way that is notably different? I'm just curious as to why you mentioned gender at all, since it didn't seem relevant to the original exchange between TGO and Greenfairy.

    (If it seems I am picking on you too much about this, it is only because I often feel I misunderstand similar comments, and your answers to my questions may help me do better.)
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  2. #172
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    I'm just curious as to why you mentioned gender at all, since it didn't seem relevant to the original exchange between TGO and Greenfairy.
    If you can't see the relevance of my mentioning 'female NTs' when TGO made a claim about NTs while talking to a female, there's nothing more I can say to get you to understand.

  3. #173
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jaguar View Post
    If you can't see the relevance of my mentioning 'female NTs' when TGO made a claim about NTs while talking to a female, there's nothing more I can say to get you to understand.
    Specifying female NTs is relevant only if you see the behavior of female NTs as significantly different from that of male NTs. Since the focus here seemed on NT behavior in general (e.g. they can lose their cool, too, whether male or female) the distinction seemed irrelevant. In other words, adding the word "female" was not necessary for the point you were trying to make, and suggested another dimension to your comment that wasn't really there.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  4. #174
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Oh but they are so entertaining to read. Don't worry - I'm not joining the ESTJ-hate. I'm equally amused reading similar stuff about my own type. I think it is the blatant typism and illogic of it all.
    It's like picking a satisfying scab, which exists in peoples heads and doesn't belong to yourself.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  5. #175
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    @Coriolis: My impression upon reading the comments is that @Jaguar was reading TGO's comment as somehow tying my losing my cool to being female, and using that to refute my supposed NT status. I.e. females lose their cool more often than males, and such behavior means you can't be an NT.

    Nonsense, of course, whatever TGO's line of thinking was. I hadn't even interpreted it that way until it was brought up; to be honest I wondered the same thing, but I think this is the answer.

    And this is in addition to him losing his cool first, as an ENTP, in reaction to something I said.

  6. #176
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    re ESTJ hate:
    When first learning about typology I projected all sorts of negative things onto ESTJ's, but that changed quickly when I actually got to know some of them. I think people should get to know at least one healthy and nice person of each type before thinking anything negative about the type.

    And really, there's probably nothing a whole type has in common anyway, other than really abstract modes of cognitive functioning.

  7. #177
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    @Coriolis: My impression upon reading the comments is that @Jaguar was reading TGO's comment as somehow tying my losing my cool to being female, and using that to refute my supposed NT status. I.e. females lose their cool more often than males, and such behavior means you can't be an NT.
    If TGO was implying you lose your cool because you are female, and therefore cannot be an NT, this is very close to saying that women can't be NTs. (Yes, there are fewer female NTs than male, but that is true of all T types). Or, did he mean that female NTs lose their cool more than males? Which assertion was the five years of female NT behavior referenced by Jaguar supposed to support (or contradict)?

    TGO's remark didn't make sense when I first read it, and it still doesn't. I thought I understood Jaguar, but from his replies, I obviously do not. I think I will just give up on this one.

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    re ESTJ hate:
    When first learning about typology I projected all sorts of negative things onto ESTJ's, but that changed quickly when I actually got to know some of them. I think people should get to know at least one healthy and nice person of each type before thinking anything negative about the type.

    And really, there's probably nothing a whole type has in common anyway, other than really abstract modes of cognitive functioning.
    It is equally unrealistic to see only positive in any type. There certainly are negative aspects to ESTJs, the key is to remember that this is true of every type.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  8. #178
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    It is equally unrealistic to see only positive in any type. There certainly are negative aspects to ESTJs, the key is to remember that this is true of every type.
    Right; it's just potentialities for behavior and traits based on underlying patterns, like Enneagram or astrology. People can do opposite things for the same sorts of reasons, based on common psychological dispositions. I'm probably not explaining it well, but it does make sense in my head.

    I've learned this from my time on here too. While types tend to produce common behaviors and traits, it doesn't really work the other way around.

  9. #179
    Senior Member Jaguar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    My impression upon reading the comments is that @Jaguar was reading TGO's comment as somehow tying my losing my cool to being female, and using that to refute my supposed NT status. I.e. females lose their cool more often than males, and such behavior means you can't be an NT.

    Nonsense, of course, whatever TGO's line of thinking was. I hadn't even interpreted it that way until it was brought up; to be honest I wondered the same thing, but I think this is the answer.
    You win the prize.

  10. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Right; it's just potentialities for behavior and traits based on underlying patterns, like Enneagram or astrology. People can do opposite things for the same sorts of reasons, based on common psychological dispositions. I'm probably not explaining it well, but it does make sense in my head.

    I've learned this from my time on here too. While types tend to produce common behaviors and traits, it doesn't really work the other way around.
    there is a gray area to be walked here - pushing it to either extremes will break the system:

    if every pattern and behavior can be linked to any type, how do you state that "someone is not type X"? everyone is every type.
    if you eliminate natural human behaviors from various types, a type is going to be an empty silhouette with no person to apply to.

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