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  1. #1
    Anew Leaf
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    Default Solving the F Problem

    As an F, I've been comfortable allowing my emotional state to influence and guide my life. However, I often wonder how wise this is. I mean, the emotional state is so ephemeral, and it bothers me when something feels right and then I discover it's not actually right. I feel like I am then questioning the deep essence of myself or my sanity or both.

    I am not even sure if this is really a problem here, or just the nature of the beast of which I should be aware.

    I'm primarily curious if anyone has any thoughts, their own experiences, etc about this topic... if it IS a topic.

  2. #2
    WALMART
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    I reckon feelings exist for a reason. I think of it as the whole of your thoughts in a brush stroke. I don't see a problem with following what they tell you, because as I am sure you are aware, people who compartmentalize their thoughts have equal opportunity to be wrong.


    I don't think it's much a problem. Until they start telling you to kill someone

  3. #3
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    As an F, I've been comfortable allowing my emotional state to influence and guide my life. However, I often wonder how wise this is. I mean, the emotional state is so ephemeral, and it bothers me when something feels right and then I discover it's not actually right. I feel like I am then questioning the deep essence of myself or my sanity or both.

    I am not even sure if this is really a problem here, or just the nature of the beast of which I should be aware.

    I'm primarily curious if anyone has any thoughts, their own experiences, etc about this topic... if it IS a topic.
    Good topic and it's similar, although much less vitriolic, than the one I made about the point of feeling.

    Honestly the intellectualisation of emotional content frightens me, because I adhere to it so strongly and i'm aware I do. However despite this there are times when I cannot stop the immediate reaction of this emotional content.

    What's more even the positive emotions are frightening, after all what happens when they stop? It's like a drug; when i'm content I want the feeling to last forever and it is all the more bitter for me when it doesn't. So ive tried to prosper in spite of this, going against the emotions lest I fall into depression.

    So far this appears to be a good move and has helped me move out of tragic cycles of emotional states that are of no use to me or those around me.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  4. #4
    Society
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    i think its a juggling act.

    the way i see it, at various points in our early lives, we have encountered stressful situations of emotional dissonance and cognitive dissonance, which can conflict quite easily, and somehow, our brains have decided that one is more stressful and unbearable then the other, determining whether we'll be Feelers or Thinkers, and orienting our function order in order to better cope with the respective stress.

    the reality is, we need to cope with both.

  5. #5
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    As an F, I've been comfortable allowing my emotional state to influence and guide my life. However, I often wonder how wise this is.
    As a "T" - I was emotionally under-developed until only a few years ago (aka, the tender age of 35).
    I did not let my feelings rule my life, not at all.
    And trust me, that course is completely screwed up to navigate also.
    Try solving matters of the heart by building a quantitative decision model in MS Excel - yeah, a really bad idea, don't do it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I mean, the emotional state is so ephemeral, and it bothers me when something feels right and then I discover it's not actually right...
    You bring up an interesting point!
    There are things I have VERY STRONG FEELINGS ABOUT, and those things are in line with my CORE VALUES.

    So, to me, "Feelings" = ephemeral (potentially) - or even more simply "physiological feedback."
    Whereas "Core Values", "Beliefs", and "Principles" are things that have solidified (and in my case for damn good reason) themselves into me over long periods of time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I feel like I am then questioning the deep essence of myself or my sanity or both.
    You don't have to question the (a) deep essence of yourself, or (b) your sanity.
    I offer a third option.
    Instead, consider questioning (c) how you felt based on what you knew about a given event at the time your feelings registered about it.

    For instance, few will argue with the concept of "allowing one's self to become wiser as time moves on, and our knowledge and experience grows."
    So, is it not also appropriate to consider "allowing yourself to feel differntly about things than you did in the past, based on what you've learned since those feelings were formed?"

    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I am not even sure if this is really a problem here, or just the nature of the beast of which I should be aware.
    It's not a problem unless this phenomena is somehow interfering with your ability to live a normal & productive life, IMHO.
    It would be an interesting thing to keep tabs on over time for the sake of learning about yourself though.
    Why not?
    I did so with my feelings years ago, and it did a damn large bit of good in developing them in a short stretch of time.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    I'm primarily curious if anyone has any thoughts, their own experiences, etc about this topic... if it IS a topic.
    See above.



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  6. #6
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Interesting, I can understand that. I personally distrust strong emotion and see positive emotion as in accordance with ultimate reality because it is consistent with knowing truth. "Negative" (unpleasant) emotions can come from both truth and illusion- illusion leads to suffering. I think there is a difference between unpleasant emotion and suffering. If the emotion is a natural reaction to real life and proportional to the situation it is healthy. I'm not sure I can identify with letting emotional states guide your choices- can you give an example? I would greatly like to have enough emotional balance to be able to do this. I think it comes from inner harmony and peace. What you say about questioning yourself I think comes from the fact that emotions if they are operating correctly tell about our well being. So if we are in a state of balance we can instantly know how we relate to the world without having to analytically evaluate it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    You don't have to question the (a) deep essence of yourself, or (b) your sanity.
    I offer a third option.
    Instead, consider questioning (c) how you felt based on what you knew about a given event at the time your feelings registered about it.

    For instance, few will argue with the concept of "allowing one's self to become wiser as time moves on, and our knowledge and experience grows."
    So, is it not also appropriate to consider "allowing yourself to feel differntly about things than you did in the past, based on what you've learned since those feelings were formed?"
    That seems like a healthy way to look at it.

  7. #7
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    interesting view... like @Halla74 I've tended to make decisions in some fairly horribly logical manners... mostly in my case drawing out the problem in a web on paper and drawing in various solutions and possible outcomes... I have decision sheets littering the area under my end table (I prefer to keep them for in case I question myself in the future... then I can see why I decided that...)

    I think that either going purely on emotions or logic has it's fallbacks- when running a team of people I always made decisions that would affect all of us by consensus except for the last one- leaving... mostly because it let a variety of bases go into making the decisions and that seemed to work for the best... more factors considered equals better decisions I guess?

    I'm not one who really trusts their own feelings though... I'd pretty happily trade in the ability to feel from time to time- for those of y'all who DO trust them, more power to you!
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  8. #8
    Glycerine
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    As an F, I've been comfortable allowing my emotional state to influence and guide my life. However, I often wonder how wise this is. I mean, the emotional state is so ephemeral, and it bothers me when something feels right and then I discover it's not actually right. I feel like I am then questioning the deep essence of myself or my sanity or both.

    I am not even sure if this is really a problem here, or just the nature of the beast of which I should be aware.

    I'm primarily curious if anyone has any thoughts, their own experiences, etc about this topic... if it IS a topic.
    I think you need both logic and emotion equally to be the most rational/logical person you can be. It made me think of this passage of a book I read called the "Happiness Hypothesis". I thought the author framed it in an interesting light.
    Happy New Years!



  9. #9
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Every so often, emotional (as well as perceptual) impulses tug at me.. and I've followed them at times.. but mostly the idea scares the crap out of me. Perhaps Perceptual thinking is even worse.. it's more out of control and irrational. At least Fi is "judgement" based, not irrational. In any case, if you desired to be logical, you'd probably have to experience the same kind of anxiety and want to step back and willfully be logical. If F based decisions don't alarm you the moment you're aware of them, then it's too natural for you to really step back. Perhaps you'd be better off with an outside source of logic, a friend, to help out instead. It's a big world. It's logical to assume you don't have to do everything yourself.

  10. #10
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glycerine View Post
    I think you need both logic and emotion equally to be the most rational/logical person you can be. It made think of this passage of a book I read called the "Happiness Hypothesis". I thought the author framed it in an interesting light.
    I see logic as a process, and emotion as one of many inputs to that process. Ignoring emotion is as counterproductive as ignoring any other relevant data, as is according it too much importance.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

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