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  1. #1
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Default A question about Ti..

    Does Ti sieve information for it's logical accuracy and consistency?

    If so, is accuracy closer to truth?

    If accuracy is closer to truth, does that mean Ti is anti-lying?

    If it is anti-lying, does that make Fe pro-lying?

    I understand that the dichotomous relationship between cognitive functions helps explain, (within the confines of the theory), how one always suppresses the other. Thinking is not often allowed to interfere with Feeling in a Fe dom and if it does, then it is never allowed to distort Fe aims, which is why it is not true Ti. The same, vice versa, goes for Fe in a Ti dom.

    The difference is that Fe often only relies on the rational that...'other people think so' whereas Ti would appear to induce an examination of such information to see if it consistently holds together in the first place.

    It is hard for me to ignore that this appears to conclude that Fe would go along with a bad value to preserve it's value and sense of 'feeling well'.

    Have I understood this correctly?

    I have probably over-simplified it.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  2. #2
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Does Ti sieve information for it's logical accuracy and consistency?
    Ti forms an logical solution from perceptions(both external and internal).


    If so, is accuracy closer to truth?
    you didnt say closer to truth than what. but its not about truth, its about whether it makes logical sense or not. if the perceptions are not overlooked, its more often than not in line with the truth. but Ti itself has nothing to do with truth, its just about logic and people with Ti dom or aux tend to think that its the best way to form truthful opinions, since everything is logical, its just about whether people can see the underlying logic or not.


    If accuracy is closer to truth, does that mean Ti is anti-lying?

    If it is anti-lying, does that make Fe pro-lying?
    has nothing to do with lying and no, it doesent make Fe pro-lying. its actually Te doms that are the best liars according to some limited data from nardi.

    I understand that the dichotomous relationship between cognitive functions helps explain, (within the confines of the theory), how one always suppresses the other. Thinking is not often allowed to interfere with Feeling in a Fe dom and if it does, then it is never allowed to distort Fe aims, which is why it is not true Ti. The same, vice versa, goes for Fe in a Ti dom.
    yes there is a repression towards the opposites, but its about the ego and shadow. when Ti is dom and Fe undeveloped, there is much repression towards Fe, so its in the shadow, but if Fe is developed, its not so much in the shadow and is not repressed as much. its not true that Ti and Fe aims cant find a mutual understanding in thought, being able to do that(uniting the opposites) is what developing as a human being is about. i suggest reading http://www.typologycentral.com/forum...all-types.html


    The difference is that Fe often only relies on the rational that...'other people think so' whereas Ti would appear to induce an examination of such information to see if it consistently holds together in the first place.
    Fe isnt really about that, its more about adopting what is considered as right or wrong from others.


    It is hard for me to ignore that this appears to conclude that Fe would go along with a bad value to preserve it's value and sense of 'feeling well'.
    i dont understand where you got that from.

    Have I understood this correctly?
    most likely not.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  3. #3
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post

    most likely not.
    Good, I was getting sick of seeing this type of shite thrown around.

    In truth my own understandings shift from moment to moment. I seem to take the same information and understand it differently every time.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  4. #4
    Member COLORATURA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Does Ti sieve information for it's logical accuracy and consistency?

    If so, is accuracy closer to truth?

    If accuracy is closer to truth, does that mean Ti is anti-lying?

    If it is anti-lying, does that make Fe pro-lying?

    I understand that the dichotomous relationship between cognitive functions helps explain, (within the confines of the theory), how one always suppresses the other. Thinking is not often allowed to interfere with Feeling in a Fe dom and if it does, then it is never allowed to distort Fe aims, which is why it is not true Ti. The same, vice versa, goes for Fe in a Ti dom.

    The difference is that Fe often only relies on the rational that...'other people think so' whereas Ti would appear to induce an examination of such information to see if it consistently holds together in the first place.

    It is hard for me to ignore that this appears to conclude that Fe would go along with a bad value to preserve it's value and sense of 'feeling well'.

    Have I understood this correctly?

    I have probably over-simplified it.
    You have definitely oversimplified. I see where you could have come to this conclusion, but it really isn't so. True, Fe doms will adopt a...let's say diplomatic attitude towards their group of peers. Many times, they are willing to not speak certain things to keep others happy. They are all about making the people around them happy. However, you can't assume that means that they will lie. It means that they want to make others happy, but they also use Ti for problem solving when there are issues with the people they love. When I have issues as a Ti dom, I will switch to Fe at times, and ask others for advice. I am saying all of this in a very..."personal" way. The reason being, these are PERSONALITY theories. Not theories about a machine & it's function of dissecting information.

    Not one function will ever be more "truthful" than another. They are only means (or descriptions) of behavior.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by COLORATURA View Post
    You have definitely oversimplified. I see where you could have come to this conclusion, but it really isn't so. True, Fe doms will adopt a...let's say diplomatic attitude towards their group of peers. Many times, they are willing to not speak certain things to keep others happy. They are all about making the people around them happy. However, you can't assume that means that they will lie. It means that they want to make others happy, but they also use Ti for problem solving when there are issues with the people they love. When I have issues as a Ti dom, I will switch to Fe at times, and ask others for advice. I am saying all of this in a very..."personal" way. The reason being, these are PERSONALITY theories. Not theories about a machine & it's function of dissecting information.

    Not one function will ever be more "truthful" than another. They are only means (or descriptions) of behavior.
    Interesting that the answers here are more clear than my own questions. Thank you for this.

    I am a Fe dominant by the way. I suppose the brain degradation of age has begun early for me.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  6. #6
    Member COLORATURA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Interesting that the answers here are more clear than my own questions. Thank you for this.

    I am a Fe dominant by the way. I suppose the brain degradation of age has begun early for me.
    No, I don't think so. I think you are trying to understand the difference between the functions, and that is good. I think that as an Fe dom you are definitely going to be diplomatic, and very good at that. However, defining things, I am sure, may be a struggle. (since Ti would be inferior)
    Just remember, we all have our strengths...

    My VERY best friend is an ESFJ. She helps me, and I help her. She was raised around alot of dominant thinkers, and therefore VALUES logic. It is quite interesting to see her around other Fe doms who weren't raised in that atmosphere.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by COLORATURA View Post
    No, I don't think so. I think you are trying to understand the difference between the functions, and that is good. I think that as an Fe dom you are definitely going to be diplomatic, and very good at that. However, defining things, I am sure, may be a struggle. (since Ti would be inferior)
    Just remember, we all have our strengths...
    Yes definers are hard but I struggle to accept my strength's as strength's, to me there are other strength's worth having and I naively idealise them more. But this is an entertaining problem to work on.

    Quote Originally Posted by COLORATURA View Post
    My VERY best friend is an ESFJ. She helps me, and I help her. She was raised around alot of dominant thinkers, and therefore VALUES logic. It is quite interesting to see her around other Fe doms who weren't raised in that atmosphere.
    I am similar, although perhaps not the same. I value logic a great deal, even if I fall short of it in many many cases. My mantra is understanding the value in logic for feelers and understanding the logic in values for thinkers.

    But...words are pretty and easily spoken. Adhering to what im saying is proving most difficult.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  8. #8
    Member COLORATURA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Yes definers are hard but I struggle to accept my strength's as strength's, to me there are other strength's worth having and I naively idealise them more. But this is an entertaining problem to work on.



    I am similar, although perhaps not the same. I value logic a great deal, even if I fall short of it in many many cases. My mantra is understanding the value in logic for feelers and understanding the logic in values for thinkers.

    But...words are pretty and easily spoken. Adhering to what im saying is proving most difficult.
    Yes, I think I have definitely learned the value of feeling. I have learned the limits of logic. It is most helpful to push yourself by being around others whom are different from you, and trying to see yourself through their eyes.

    I am so thankful for my ESFJ friend whom has helped me battle & understand the arena of relationships. I have helped her analyze unusual behavior, and taught her to separate & compartmentalize her feelings to keep them from affecting her.
    I truly believe we all need each other, and if everyone realized that we all have something to give, and are all connected to one another...the world would suck alot less.
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