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  1. #21
    Senior Member Tabula's Avatar
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    What is "fake logic?" I don't get it. If person A used logic to get an answer, and person B didn't but got the same (correct) answer, I wouldn't say person B was "faking logic;" he's not using logic at all--just some other method. Can someone explain this to me?

  2. #22
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabula View Post
    What is "fake logic?" I don't get it. If person A used logic to get an answer, and person B didn't but got the same (correct) answer, I wouldn't say person B was "faking logic;" he's not using logic at all--just some other method. Can someone explain this to me?
    she didnt say that there is some thing called "fake logic". she said "only two types actually use the logic center of our brains, rest of us fake it...we can all learn to use it". for example one could use memory instead of logic when solving a logic problem. "hey this seems quite much like the problem i saw last year, ill check is the same method for solving this one works here too". or someone might just try different methods of solving it, instead of actually using logic to think which method would work.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  3. #23
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    she didnt say that there is some thing called "fake logic". she said "only two types actually use the logic center of our brains, rest of us fake it...we can all learn to use it". for example one could use memory instead of logic when solving a logic problem. "hey this seems quite much like the problem i saw last year, ill check is the same method for solving this one works here too". or someone might just try different methods of solving it, instead of actually using logic to think which method would work.
    I suspect that I'm one of those who 'fake logic' -- but wonder how this happens in my brain. I used to have a lot of fun with logic games and I thought I was pretty good at those. And now I'm intrigued by what 'real logic' is like
    4w5 sp/sx EII

  4. #24
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    she didnt say that there is some thing called "fake logic". she said "only two types actually use the logic center of our brains, rest of us fake it...we can all learn to use it". for example one could use memory instead of logic when solving a logic problem. "hey this seems quite much like the problem i saw last year, ill check is the same method for solving this one works here too". or someone might just try different methods of solving it, instead of actually using logic to think which method would work.
    True, but I would also add that there has to be a logical underpinning to most of the systems we create.

    Like mathematics for example. Even generally illogical people have to use logic to understand a relationship like 1 + 1 = 2.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  5. #25
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 21% View Post
    And now I'm intrigued by what 'real logic' is like
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  6. #26
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    True, but I would also add that there has to be a logical underpinning to most of the systems we create.

    Like mathematics for example. Even generally illogical people have to use logic to understand a relationship like 1 + 1 = 2.
    im pretty sure she meant that only two types are often using it and using it on more complex tasks. also as i mentioned memory, 1+1=2 is something that can be easily remembered and i dont think that anyone has to use their logic center to know that adding 1 to 1 is 2
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
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  7. #27
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    im pretty sure she meant that only two types are often using it and using it on more complex tasks. also as i mentioned memory, 1+1=2 is something that can be easily remembered and i dont think that anyone has to use their logic center to know that adding 1 to 1 is 2
    I agree, but I think someone does have to understand WHY 1 + 1 = 2 for it to have any basis at all. Although it is true this wasn't really relevant to the 'logic centre' of the brain discussion to do with type.

    And memory masquerading as logic is a common pitfall I find. I know I do it all the time, but that's largely when dealing with problems I have no knowledge of. I usually go for an experimental approach first, gather some information try and work out a plan of attack. But if that fails I either fall back on others knowledge or go by a past method.

    In typology this could be attributed to Si..Te maybe. However I am not a logical thinker and I openly admit it, not so I can disregard logic of course, but out of some misguided notion of honesty and acceptance. But of course memory also plays an important part in what we know, it is both the cornerstone of our personalities and our knowledge and yet...at the same time not the be all of our systems of reasoning. Could logic work without the basis input of a memory data-base in the first place though?

    And I'm not talking about the usual considerations of what memory is, as in the individual with their acquired knowledge, so much as how it defines us in terms of knowing how to speak, knowing what something actually is....knowing what 'knowing' actually entails and understanding why that should be.

    Incidentally I was trying to research the logic centre of the brain, but I couldn't find much to justify the term 'logic centre'. Possibly I wasn't looking in the right place. Although I do know she meant in terms of Dario Nardi's mappings.

    I did find this however: http://www.atlantabrainandspine.com/...in-anatomy-066

    In any case, what do you think the two types were? ITP's? ETJ's?
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  8. #28
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    I agree, but I think someone does have to understand WHY 1 + 1 = 2 for it to have any basis at all. Although it is true this wasn't really relevant to the 'logic centre' of the brain discussion to do with type.

    And memory masquerading as logic is a common pitfall I find. I know I do it all the time, but that's largely when dealing with problems I have no knowledge of. I usually go for an experimental approach first, gather some information try and work out a plan of attack. But if that fails I either fall back on others knowledge or go by a past method.

    In typology this could be attributed to Si..Te maybe. However I am not a logical thinker and I openly admit it, not so I can disregard logic of course, but out of some misguided notion of honesty and acceptance. But of course memory also plays an important part in what we know, it is both the cornerstone of our personalities and our knowledge and yet...at the same time not the be all of our systems of reasoning. Could logic work without the basis input of a memory data-base in the first place though?

    And I'm not talking about the usual considerations of what memory is, as in the individual with their acquired knowledge, so much as how it defines us in terms of knowing how to speak, knowing what something actually is....knowing what 'knowing' actually entails and understanding why that should be.

    Incidentally I was trying to research the logic centre of the brain, but I couldn't find much to justify the term 'logic centre'. Possibly I wasn't looking in the right place. Although I do know she meant in terms of Dario Nardi's mappings.

    I did find this however: http://www.atlantabrainandspine.com/...in-anatomy-066

    In any case, what do you think the two types were? ITP's? ETJ's?
    im pretty sure i remember reading some pdf from nardi where he said that ESTPs and INTPs use the "logic center" the most.

    i suggest reading this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...he_human_brain and clicking the links for functions of those areas, also there is this bit more simplified distinction of brain areas which is pretty popular and thought in neuropsychology classes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brodman...human_primates .
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  9. #29
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    im pretty sure i remember reading some pdf from nardi where he said that ESTPs and INTPs use the "logic center" the most.

    i suggest reading this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...he_human_brain and clicking the links for functions of those areas, also there is this bit more simplified distinction of brain areas which is pretty popular and thought in neuropsychology classes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brodman...human_primates .
    Thanks! I'll have a gander.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  10. #30
    pathwise dependent FDG's Avatar
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    I mostly relate to the Ni description.
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