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  1. #21
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    I think being more extroverted, less sensitive, and more able to have an F-U mentality when younger probably would have made things a lot easier / I would have been more able to be happy.

    But I like who I am and don't think I'd change that, even if it means I'm kinda on my own in a lot of ways and it does cause me problems/issues.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  2. #22
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    MBTI: yes, INTJ or ENTJ
    Enneagram: yes, 8w7 or 3w4
    Instinct Variant: no
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
    ENFP
    5w4>1w9>2w1 Sx/Sp
    SEE-Fi
    Papa Bear
    Motivation: Dark Worker
    Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
    Chibi Seme
    MTG Color: black/red
    Male Archtype: King/Lover
    Sunburst!
    "You are a gay version of Gambit" Speed Gavroche
    "I wish that I could be affected by any hate, but I can't, cuz I just get affected by the bank" Chamillionaire

  3. #23
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    An ESTP 1w2 would be rather strange, IMHO.
    I'd change to a 7w8
    Last edited by EJCC; 09-30-2012 at 11:48 PM.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
    1w2/7w6/3w4 so/sx (enneagram)
    want to ask me something? go for it!

  4. #24
    Honor Thy Inferior Such Irony's Avatar
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    MBTI: Sometimes I wish I was more extraverted. Then again I have moments where I embrace my introversion. I think I've wished to be most of the types at one time or another. It would be interesting if we could rotate between all 16 of the types. I suppose we might lose some of our self-identity doing that.

    Enneagram: More 7 and 8ish. Again would be interesting to rotate between the types.

    Variant: I probably wouldn't change it but sometimes I wonder how my life would be different if I had more SX.
    INtp
    5w6 or 9w1 sp/so/sx, I think
    Ravenclaw/Hufflepuff
    Neutral Good
    LII-Ne




  5. #25
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by metalmommy View Post
    I've heard similar things from other thinkers, usually during a conversation telling me how my ability to deal with feelings is a benefit somehow. And it's not really an ability per se, it's just that I have to do something or I'll be a useless mess

    I just cannot imagine why anyone would want this. I've heard that from enough thinkers that I know it's a genuine desire...but... why? lol
    Not all thinkers have this desire. I certainly do not. Yes, the ability to deal with feelings and with people is a benefit, one I lack. But my ability to deal with logistics and contingencies and even to put aside feelings is a benefit as well. It can be tempting to find the grass greener on the other side of the fence, but the neighbors might not have my prolific tomato plants, or your lovely rose garden. I have never wished to be other than I am, because I know that getting different abilities would mean accepting different flaws. It is no net gain, just a different way to be. I am comfortable, productive, and fulfilled as I am, so why change?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    It doesn't help to be rational
    When people are irrational.

    It's hard to ever feel "moved" if you are always in the perspective of thinking and evaluating.

    Expressing emotion or dealing with feelings are unjustifiable even when it's necessary.
    When other people are being irrational, it doesn't help to add one more irrational person to the mix. It may be harder for NTs, especially NTJs, to feel moved, but is certainly not impossible. Those of us that want that experience just need to learn to understand what will produce it, and seek that out, or seize the moment when it appears. Expressing emotion and dealing with feelings is difficult even when it is necessary, but easily avoided in the many situations where it is counterproductive.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #26
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    When other people are being irrational, it doesn't help to add one more irrational person to the mix. [/QUOTE]

    I meant in responding to other people's emotions or trying to determine how they will react to things not in reference to problem solving. People don't always do the rational thing so it makes them hard to predict. My friend Peter gets in moods where he says everyone hates him. I used to try to point out that that was stupid thought with him to disastrous results. Now I've learned that he just wants to be heard. Sometimes on paper you're perfect for someone but t just doesn't work. When people are feeling things a rational approach doesn't always work.




    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    It may be harder for NTs, especially NTJs, to feel moved, but is certainly not impossible. Those of us that want that experience just need to learn to understand what will produce it, and seek that out, or seize the moment when it appears.
    I never said impossible only hard. I think seeking out opportunities to be moved is counterproductive. You are just analyzing your level of "movedness" the whole time. As soon as I become aware that I might me be move the moment is lost because I being to evaluate it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Expressing emotion and dealing with feelings is difficult even when it is necessary, but easily avoided in the many situations where it is counterproductive.

    I think NTs, at least myself, designate emotions as counterproductive more often than they should.

  7. #27
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    I meant in responding to other people's emotions or trying to determine how they will react to things not in reference to problem solving. People don't always do the rational thing so it makes them hard to predict. My friend Peter gets in moods where he says everyone hates him. I used to try to point out that that was stupid thought with him to disastrous results. Now I've learned that he just wants to be heard. Sometimes on paper you're perfect for someone but t just doesn't work. When people are feeling things a rational approach doesn't always work.
    The highlighted is a rational response. You have evaluated the situation logically, determined that your original approach has been ineffective, and identified a more productive response -- just listening to your friend. Forcing someone else to analyze their troubles logically is not always the most logical course of action.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    I never said impossible only hard. I think seeking out opportunities to be moved is counterproductive. You are just analyzing your level of "movedness" the whole time. As soon as I become aware that I might me be move the moment is lost because I being to evaluate it.
    I suppose that depends on what you find moving. I am frequently moved by art, as well as by nature. I can easily seek out such opportunities by going hiking in parks or nature preserves, listening to music, visiting museums, even just reading a good book or watching the sunset. For the rest of it, I just watch for unexpected opportunities that come along.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  8. #28
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    I like who I am. I don't think I would want to be different. Perhaps a bit more J, but not a full-out J. Just a bit more controlled P. Naw. Nevermind.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The highlighted is a rational response. You have evaluated the situation logically, determined that your original approach has been ineffective, and identified a more productive response -- just listening to your friend. Forcing someone else to analyze their troubles logically is not always the most logical course of action.
    Rational egoism maybe but I would argue not purely rational since it involves acting in accordance to irrational thoughts based on misinterpretations of reality. It don't think it's reasonable to indulge someone who is being stupid but it is convenient. I would call altering your behavior to respond to non-facts strategic not rational.


    [QUOTE=Coriolis;1968821 I suppose that depends on what you find moving. I am frequently moved by art, as well as by nature. I can easily seek out such opportunities by going hiking in parks or nature preserves, listening to music, visiting museums, even just reading a good book or watching the sunset. For the rest of it, I just watch for unexpected opportunities that come along.[/QUOTE]

    I'm not so easily moved. I love nature, or art (and I'm an artist). Even if I can appreciate it I'm not absorbed by it. It is easier to get lost in music though but it's still, most of the time, catharsis than like the sublime. It's a medium through which to fell rather than something that evokes great feelings in and of itself.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    The highlighted is a rational response. You have evaluated the situation logically, determined that your original approach has been ineffective, and identified a more productive response -- just listening to your friend. Forcing someone else to analyze their troubles logically is not always the most logical course of action.
    Rational egoism maybe but I would argue not purely rational since it involves acting in accordance to irrational thoughts based on misinterpretations of reality. It don't think it's reasonable to indulge someone who is being stupid but it is convenient. I would call altering your behavior to respond to non-facts strategic not rational.


    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    I suppose that depends on what you find moving. I am frequently moved by art, as well as by nature. I can easily seek out such opportunities by going hiking in parks or nature preserves, listening to music, visiting museums, even just reading a good book or watching the sunset. For the rest of it, I just watch for unexpected opportunities that come along.
    I'm not so easily moved. I love nature, or art (and I'm an artist). Even if I can appreciate it I'm not absorbed by it. It is easier to get lost in music though but it's still, most of the time, catharsis than like the sublime. It's a medium through which to fell rather than something that evokes great feelings in and of itself.

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