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Why do people have a problem with people mistyping themselves?

greenfairy

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It does sound like an interesting thread.

Any "mystic" side I have involves more a sense of archetypes and patterns, but I don't really credit them any special power in a tangible sense -- it's all about what they can evoke collectively. (Or is that all mysticism is? Maybe we need to even clarify what is meant by mysticism.)

This is a large part of my mysticism. I use patterns and archetypes a lot. It also has to do with "just knowing" things, much like what I've read about Ni. It's about intuitive knowledge, and translating subjective experience into a system of underlying patterns of reality. I use my intuitive sense as an extra sense, to give me information about reality which I then have to process. I have information from the analytical side of reality, of scientific data, facts, and reasoning, and then I have information which comes from more unconscious sources; I integrate all of this into a framework which fully contains the subjective within the objective. Reading about Ti logical frameworks, they appear to fit my internal world. Maybe not? But the concepts apply. I use a logical process to integrate all the information.
 

greenfairy

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I went through this when I first entered type, because for one thing, I was dealing with a so-called "expert" who tended to go around saying a lot of people were "mistyped", and the tack was always to push people who thought they were T's to F, and from TiFe to FiTe. Even if you didn't understand the theory quick enough, you must be a slow-witted FP (in contrast to quickwitted TP's), and if you did not get the social vibe fast enough, you were a self-absorbed FP as opposed to a selfless FJ); and "liking" a particular type was even tossed out there at me as "Fi" as well.
And when I first arrived here, this sort of thinking seemed to be prevalent. Look at the early "Mistyped Members" thread and you can see some of this.

But "liking" is not a product of Fi; it's a product of the ego. Fi would be more attention to things you like, and determining what is wholesome, and using thi sense to make judgments.

Oversimplifications like this are why these misunderstandings occur.

OK, that's good information regarding the early climate of the forum I witnessed and described, and the problem we're discussing. (I had never even heard of this "iNtuitive Central" before, and assumed it was perhaps the influence of the expert I mentioned).

[MENTION=15773]greenfairy[/MENTION], what I find another thing that seems to blur T/F for INP's is the Interaction Style, and particularly that it embodies two possible temperaments, one classic one, and another that is newly discovered.

The typical INTP would fit this corresponding temperament in this other system:
http://www.pastoral-counseling-center.org/Temperament-Area-of-Inclusion/phlegmatic-inclusion.htm

While INFP (And the ISF's who are also the same Interaction Style) might fit:
http://www.pastoral-counseling-center.org/Temperament-Area-of-Inclusion/supine-inclusion.htm

This last one is the new one, recognized only in that system. (So the ISF's basically fit "Phlegmatic" by default, as that was the closest thing in four temperament systems).

But what I find, beginning in my own experience, and some others I've discussed this with, such as [MENTION=7]Jennifer[/MENTION] and [MENTION=10653]SuchIrony[/MENTION], is that when an INTP falls into that latter temperament, they take on some traits that have become associated with INFP and the ISF's, or even Fe in general. The biggest thing is that Supines have a higher people-focus and need for inclusion by others, which we associate with F, where Phlegmatics are really more moderate and can “take 'em or leave'em”, which would better fit the traditional INTP interaction.
Supine INTP's thus end up with T/F uncertainty, thinking they might be F, but eventually settling on T.
But this based more on traits; some of them overgeneralized, (like the "liking" things or "emotions" stuff) than functions, so they tend to strongly identify with Ti, but have these traits that have become associated with Fi, (somewhat largely mistakenly, but then other factors such as "right-brain alternatives" or shadow dynamics can explain things too).
On the flipside, you have [MENTION=6561]OrangeAppled[/MENTION], who's an INFP Phlegmatic, and also had the same T/F uncertainty, but went the other way, from T to F.

So that you could look into as well.

Awesome perspective! I will look into these links.
 

greenfairy

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I was under the impression that our experience of the world is taken in via s/n and t/f is how we make judgements about those experiences meaning.

Well right, that's what I'm saying. Si is the basis, and making judgments or attaching rationality could be seen as kind of the same thing. Some people avoid making judgments.
 

Lady_X

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Awesome post. This has helped me understand Fi a lot better. Thanks! The descriptions I read are really vague and confusing, so of course it's hard to see how they could apply to me. (I mean, what are "feeling tones? I don't think in poetry.)

I can see how I value things a lot. But that's a lot different from making value judgments, which I try to avoid. This kind of thinking, of making value judgments and establishing what is "good" and "bad" seems too much like fundamentalist Christianity; sin and redemption, good people versus evil, dualism, black and white, guilt, and the resulting destruction that happens when religious people get into other people's business. I have perceived this behavior and identified the thinking and feeling patterns I think are responsible, and attempted to eradicate them in myself.

So the words "good" and "bad" have taken on loaded connotations for me, and I tend to reject them, influencing my tests toward the thinking side. Is this T behavior, or simply Fi valuing the rejection of value judgment? I don't know. Kind of paradoxical. I don't think human valuation has anything to do with "what is," and I prefer to focus on objective reality. But I have to operate in my subjective world, because I am limited by a physical body. And it adds some fun to life.

I do evaluate whether I like and dislike things, but so does everyone. I don't really understand yet the difference between Fi likes and dislikes and everyone else's. I've found that my preferences are useful in navigating my life successfully. Most of the time it's just to decide what will make me happy, but often they unconsciously affect me intuitively. I let my intuition tell me what I should be around or avoid. I started a thread about this, to see whether the intuition I am describing is Ni or Fi, and most people said Ni. If it's actually Fi, I guess I use it a lot.

So this is my subjective experience plus my thoughts on how it relates to typology.

i get what you're saying...but there are a lot of fi users who are agnostic or atheist.

having a strong sense of right and wrong does not come from a book tho...it just doesn't...at least not for everybody
 

RaptorWizard

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Dang every thread the OP starts always transforms into smashing success and half the threads I have started hardly if at all even get any replies! People must be really interested in slamming their typing opinions into the heart and head of the OP because the last thing you need is a wannabe INTP ruining the show though I think the OP is INTx you people can think whatever other opinions you want!
 

jixmixfix

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Dang every thread the OP starts always transforms into smashing success and half the threads I have started hardly if at all even get any replies! People must be really interested in slamming their typing opinions into the heart and head of the OP because the last thing you need is a wannabe INTP ruining the show though I think the OP is INTx you people can think whatever other opinions you want!

I think it just comes down to how widespread the interest of the thread is as oppose to people wanting to prove the OP wrong.
 

Totenkindly

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Dang every thread the OP starts always transforms into smashing success and half the threads I have started hardly if at all even get any replies! People must be really interested in slamming their typing opinions into the heart and head of the OP because the last thing you need is a wannabe INTP ruining the show though I think the OP is INTx you people can think whatever other opinions you want!

I usually don't have any response to make to your threads, there usually isn't any compelling question I need to eke out a response to.
 

Lady_X

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It's very rarely personal raptor. It's just about the topic. Sometimes no one cares about my random thinking out loud questions either.

It just means I'm the only one interested in that. That's okay. Theres a lot of topics people post that I'm uninterested in.
 

Salomé

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Dang every thread the OP starts always transforms into smashing success and half the threads I have started hardly if at all even get any replies! People must be really interested in slamming their typing opinions into the heart and head of the OP because the last thing you need is a wannabe INTP ruining the show though I think the OP is INTx you people can think whatever other opinions you want!
*Questions your definition of "smashing success".*
 

Tiltyred

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I haven't read the entire thread, but I'm popping in here to say that this happens in many different kinds of typing people. I have seen it on style forums, where the group is working with different styles each having a set of parameters, and someone declares herself to be a match and belonging to one of them, and the rest of the group is like, the hell you are, for pete's sake, are you blind, and calls her out at every turn. What we came to see is that over time, the person miscategorizing herself would eventually realize that she had miscategorized herself on her own. That in the meantime, she was enjoying (for whatever reason) believing that she belonged to the type she assigned to herself. So we learned to leave it alone or very gently occasionally suggest rather than to call the person out. It's not how that works here.

The thing is, if people here think you are no freakin' frakin' way a whatever you say you are, they're probably right, actually. And they're probably old timers here, who have seen this play out so many times that they don't have patience for it anymore. They really can see you coming a mile away while you're still struggling to find your outline in the mirror in the dark. FWIW.

Edit: In other words, what Orange said.

I have had similar experience with astrology. I was taken to a party once by a friend -- I didn't know anyone there but my friend -- I was asked if I could go around the room and say everyone's sun sign. I did. The way I knew who was a Virgo was because he immediately said astrology is bullshit. :-D See how that works? That's the kind of people you're in with, on the typology thing. They know not only that it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck: they know all the duck calls, how lame ducks walk, how young ducks walk, they speak fluent duck in many languages.
 
G

garbage

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Sometimes, I wonder if it's OCD.

Similarly, it's fun to mess with engineers and accountants by leaving one stack of papers just slightly askew.
 

Lady_X

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I like tilty's answer.

And these guys helped me when I joined to see I wasn't an infp. I didn't know either. I had just heard about mbti and taken a test like the day before or something.

It just muddies the data ya know? Like people learn by picking up patterns of behaviors from the posters and it just screws it all up if everyone's mistyped!

But it's hard for some people. Some people are totally hard to type. The video thread helps tho. I hope you try that.
 

Orangey

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The only pattern I've seen is E/ISFJs playing at being other types, agreeing with one another's experiences, and then expanding those experiences to the types they claim to be.
 

Eugene Watson VIII

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Because you want to be typed and people might get annoyed if you don't consider what they have to say.
 

greenfairy

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Dang every thread the OP starts always transforms into smashing success and half the threads I have started hardly if at all even get any replies! People must be really interested in slamming their typing opinions into the heart and head of the OP because the last thing you need is a wannabe INTP ruining the show though I think the OP is INTx you people can think whatever other opinions you want!

:)

I don't know if most people would call my threads "smashing successes..."

*Reads more posts, edits:
*Questions your definition of "smashing success".*
Right.

See, we have something in common!
 

greenfairy

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Because you want to be typed and people might get annoyed if you don't consider what they have to say.

I have considered it many times, and I evaluate each comment. I just have reasons why I think of things differently, and people don't really want to thoroughly discuss all the details because they see that as arguing. Well, I can't change my mind without argument. I can't believe I'm wrong until I'm proven wrong. I can't change my mind based on social pressure. Even if I think I should, if I don't believe it, I don't. If I could just agree with everyone so they wouldn't be annoyed anymore, I'd probably do it. But I can't because I don't. I might in the future, but it takes a lot of in depth comments about specific cognitive functions and function order and specifically how they apply to me and why my characteristics can't be explained by other CF's. And if people don't want to go to all that trouble, I'm not going to change my mind. If people are annoyed enough, that's what they have to do. Debate with me about my type and win. I am listening. And I am starting to see how I could be INFP, I'm just not there yet.
 

copperfish17

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I have considered it many times, and I evaluate each comment. I just have reasons why I think of things differently, and people don't really want to thoroughly discuss all the details because they see that as arguing. Well, I can't change my mind without argument. I can't believe I'm wrong until I'm proven wrong. I can't change my mind based on social pressure. Even if I think I should, if I don't believe it, I don't. If I could just agree with everyone so they wouldn't be annoyed anymore, I'd probably do it. But I can't because I don't. I might in the future, but it takes a lot of in depth comments about specific cognitive functions and function order and specifically how they apply to me and why my characteristics can't be explained by other CF's. And if people don't want to go to all that trouble, I'm not going to change my mind. If people are annoyed enough, that's what they have to do. Debate with me about my type and win. I am listening. And I am starting to see how I could be INFP, I'm just not there yet.

I realize that I may come across a little aggresive with the following post, but in no way am I trying to offend you.

You know, if you're really as sure as you seem to be about your type, why are you still looking for feedback? It seems to me that you're unwilling to budge on your preformed conclusion (that you must be some kind of NT), and that's why I deleted my second post in your other forum last night - I probably deleted it before you saw it. The impression I'm getting from you is that you aren't really interested in hearing an answer other than some variety of NT (though you claim to be open to debating on it). I would hazard a guess to say that many forum members (including myself) have simply given up trying to debate w/you because you seem to be so unopen to - even dismissive of - what they've got to say.

Also, I don't understand why you aren't taking time to do some serious research on the cognitive functions yourself, 'cause I'd assume that the majority of members on this forum don't have the time to spoon-feed you the information you need. You have all the resources you need on the Internet. Granted, there's a lot of downright awful material on the interwebs as well - which is why you should exercise prudence when you pick your resources.

Again, I'm just being frank with you and am not looking to offend. I'm sorry if I did, though.
 
G

garbage

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I do like when people talk about others' types and mistypes and their experiences with certain types and so on but refuse to list one for themselves

(not directed at the OP, at all)
 
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