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  1. #71
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Feelers try to rationalise/understand their emotions.

    Thinkers let them creep up on them.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  2. #72
    Senor Membrae Eugene Watson VIII's Avatar
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    Values are pretty much the best way to sum up Fi. There's little to know what Fi cognition is, but why we value something is da game, yo
    Myers-Briggs: xsFP

    Enneagram: 9?-4wX?-5/6

    ~ People don't think it be like it is, but it do. ~

  3. #73
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    DAMN IT! I WANT TO HEAR FI USERS EXPRESS THEIR FEELINGS!


    /The end

  4. #74
    Senior Member animenagai's Avatar
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    Alright, time for a more constructive post. I can't describe Fi half as beautifully as the other members, but perhaps I can explain it in a simple way that's easy to understand. Imagine if you're really hungry at a restaurant, and finally, your favorite meal arrives at your table. Your body says 'oh yum! This is gonna be great!'. Now imagine something that really grosses you out. It can just be something from Saw or something that makes you feel repulsed.

    This feeling is basically how Fi is. We get a strong feeling - a chemical reaction within our body that either says 'I really like this' or 'man I don't like this at all'. Whenever we react with Fi, we get this reaction in our body that's instantaneous. Now, note that this feeling is by nature, private. You will never feel exactly the same way I do, nor do I always want to share how I feel. Fi is hence these feelings of 'I really like this' or 'I don't like this at all' as a collection or internal system. For example, to me as an Fi user, the moral claim 'betraying a friend is morally wrong' is very much connected to the proposition 'I feel icky and angry when I see someone betraying their friend'.

    Sometimes, I don't want people to know that I'm upset. There are several reasons for this, perhaps I don't want to offend other people, or maybe I just want other people to think of me as being tough. Whatever the reason is, these feelings often get bogged down because they were left unexpressed. Of course, that does not mean that these feelings just go away, so Fi can explode like a time bomb.

    PS. Sorry, forgot to tie it back into the OP. The way I read Fi is that I assume Fi users will never express everything. You have to keep an eye out for that. If this person is acting different, perhaps you can tell that they want to say something but isn't sure if they should say it, you know there's something boiling up inside. You can guess what they're feeling through the context of the situation.
    Chimera of Filth

    A gruesome beast with dripping flesh
    Clings to me as a sick fixture
    My throbbing heart it gnawed apart
    It stalks and hunts me through mirrors

  5. #75
    Señora Member Elfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seymour View Post
    So, for me, I'm pretty much continually aware of my emotional state. It's like an emotional barometer, whose state I am continually aware of as I go through my day. A sudden change always means something: even if that change of state is not ultimately rational, it always has a cause worth understanding.

    Plus, my emotional state is pretty much never a single thing. I'm generally not just "happy" or "sad" or "upset". Typically, I'm in some multi-layered, mixed state. At the moment, for example, I'm a little bit tired from a long day, a little keyed up and exhausted from conflict at work, mostly content with what I got done today (although I feel a little guilty that it was less than I had wanted), a little guilty because I should have been more appreciative of the dinner my partner cooked, etc, etc.

    Generally, I have a conscious awareness of my emotional state and a fairly accurate model of what effects it. If my emotional state deviates more than a little from that model, that's something the deserves attention. Generally, I have a fair amount of influence over my emotional state, but it's never direct control about what I feel. I can choose what to feed and what to ignore, what to put aside and what to attend to... but there are limits, always.

    Over time, I've learned not to confuse low blood sugar with despondency or depression, a feeling of failure with social exhaustion, or personal upset with a reaction to the state of those near me.

    Unlike an Fe-user (I think), I tend to be tuned into the state of individuals, and less so to the state of a group or roles in a group dynamic. It's like each person has a separate emotional state, which must be modeled, tracked, and empathized with individually.
    Oh, this is very spot on for my case!

    I've not related to almost anything in this thread but for this.

  6. #76
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by animenagai View Post
    Alright, time for a more constructive post. I can't describe Fi half as beautifully as the other members, but perhaps I can explain it in a simple way that's easy to understand. Imagine if you're really hungry at a restaurant, and finally, your favorite meal arrives at your table. Your body says 'oh yum! This is gonna be great!'. Now imagine something that really grosses you out. It can just be something from Saw or something that makes you feel repulsed.

    This feeling is basically how Fi is. We get a strong feeling - a chemical reaction within our body that either says 'I really like this' or 'man I don't like this at all'. Whenever we react with Fi, we get this reaction in our body that's instantaneous. Now, note that this feeling is by nature, private. You will never feel exactly the same way I do, nor do I always want to share how I feel. Fi is hence these feelings of 'I really like this' or 'I don't like this at all' as a collection or internal system. For example, to me as an Fi user, the moral claim 'betraying a friend is morally wrong' is very much connected to the proposition 'I feel icky and angry when I see someone betraying their friend'.

    Sometimes, I don't want people to know that I'm upset. There are several reasons for this, perhaps I don't want to offend other people, or maybe I just want other people to think of me as being tough. Whatever the reason is, these feelings often get bogged down because they were left unexpressed. Of course, that does not mean that these feelings just go away, so Fi can explode like a time bomb.

    PS. Sorry, forgot to tie it back into the OP. The way I read Fi is that I assume Fi users will never express everything. You have to keep an eye out for that. If this person is acting different, perhaps you can tell that they want to say something but isn't sure if they should say it, you know there's something boiling up inside. You can guess what they're feeling through the context of the situation.
    yes...and i'll just add that some things are often kept in because we feel like that's our shit that we have to deal with and it's not fair of us to put it on you.

    somethings can even feel awful without me knowing why they feel awful and i need time to dissect before discussing it.
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  7. #77
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    I thought of a way to approach this and explain what it's like. I was just flicking channels and this song (which I happen to love) was playing on MTV:



    To me this song exemplifies Fi thought and feeling processes. Gotye seems to me to be a IXFP based on his behaviour in interviews (and Kimbra, would have to be a EXFP), however his lyrics and performance of the song particularly demonstrate a Fi inner world - not just the way the people in the song think and feel, but in the way Gotye tries to evoke specific reactions in the listener. It's so conflicted, reflective, passionate, raw, contradictory, complex, deceptive, skeptical, confronting, self-aware, and so entirely immersed in the world of intense feeling tones.

    The layered, contradictory nature of feeling is perhaps the most revealling aspect - not so much the fact that he feels contradictory emotions but just how aware of them he is, how forceful they are, and how willingly he tackles them and their implications.

    The guy seems to be happy and relieved the relationship is over, but yet appears to be mourning the loss of it; he loved her and idealised her, yet felt desperately lonely at the same time; he's forgiving, and yet bitter; he's at peace with it, indifferent even, and yet incredibly hurt and angry.

    The thing is, Gotye takes this even further by providing her point of view. He makes you feel sorry for the guy and wonder about the awful things she did to him, then undermines that belief and makes you doubt it. The girl makes it seem like he was distant, cryptic and blamed her for their problems. It makes you think back to the first verses and you see his feelings, and the likely external manifestation of them, in a new light. You begin to suspect he might have been the source of the problem.

    But again Gotye takes it further. The chorus takes on new meaning this time round; now he seems to admit some blame, that he wasn't perfect, but yet he remains defiant; in spite of his mistakes she didn't need to treat him so badly afterward. And, "fair enough", the listener thinks. But again Gotye challenges him. She sings back at him; after all he had cut her off too, all through the relationship. At the end, you get a sense of pain, guilt and loss in both of them - it's a complete emotional journey within just a few minutes.

    So I suppose what I'm trying to show is the layered and conflicting nature of those emotions. It can be like disappearing down a rabbit hole that gets deeper and more convoluted as you go. So you see why it can be so hard to express this - how can you communicate that complexity clearly and succinctly without compromising the very heart of it? And it gets even harder when there literally doesn't seem to be a word that encompasses a very specific feeling you are experiencing.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
    they've gone through and through me, like wine through water, and altered the colour of my mind.

    - Emily Bronte

  8. #78
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    beautiful explanation. <3
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  9. #79
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    Fi... Fi... Fi...


    I think I might catch a whiff of it, from time to time. Luckily, there are so many other important things to think about.

  10. #80
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
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    also they seem totally infp/enfp

    and omg how infp is the line you can get addicted to a certain kind of sadness
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

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