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Thread: INTJ vs INTP

  1. #71
    null Jonny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Look at this fucking guy - didn't even bother including me on the list.
    So much for INTPs "externally based emotions."
    Oh man, how could I have missed you?

    I literally just took the names of the top INTJ and INTP posters from the Members List, and added a few more who I knew were INTP / INTJ (but who didn't have it spelled out in their profile). I don't understand how I could have missed you... /shrug

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    I wasn't included either, but sometimes it is preferable to be under the radar.
    WTF? Now I'm concerned that I had a mini stroke when I was looking at the INTJ list.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  2. #72
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    WTF? Now I'm concerned that I had a mini stroke when I was looking at the INTJ list.
    My username cloaking subroutine was that effective? *marks experiment as a success*
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  3. #73
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    One more difference: Though both are like robots, INTJ's are hard and metallic on the outside and soft and cuddly on the inside, while INTP's look personable and human on the outside and inside are made of cold, calculating titanium.

    *Ok, done with unsolicited thoughts now: will check out video in OP.

    Edit: Pretty good. I like new information. Makes me identify more with Ni, Ti, and Fe.

  4. #74
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    One more difference: Though both are like robots, INTJ's are hard and metallic on the outside and soft and cuddly on the inside, while INTP's look personable and human on the outside and inside are made of cold, calculating titanium.
    You are attempting to debunk your type's own theory? Or is it just personal wishful thinking?

    Warm fuzzy teddybear theory

    This is a theory devised by some INFJs on the "warm fuzzy teddybear" feel that surrounds some of the introverted intuitives. This is how others see the INs:

    INFJ - cold on outside, warm and fuzzy on the inside
    INFP - warm and fuzzy inside and out
    INTP - warm on the outside, hard as a rock inside
    INTJ - cold and hard inside and out
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  5. #75
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    You are attempting to debunk your type's own theory? Or is it just personal wishful thinking?
    No, I assembled it from the "Which is more robotic" thread. It makes sense to me. If you disagree, that's fine. And how would I be debunking it?

    I think it really only applies to INT's. I'd have to modify it for the INF's, since they're not robotic. Oh, and I wouldn't go so far as to call any NT warm or fuzzy enough to be a teddy bear. More like human vs. machine.

  6. #76
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    No, I assembled it from the "Which is more robotic" thread. It makes sense to me. If you disagree, that's fine. And how would I be debunking it?

    I think it really only applies to INT's. I'd have to modify it for the INF's, since they're not robotic. Oh, and I wouldn't go so far as to call any NT warm or fuzzy enough to be a teddy bear. More like human vs. machine.
    Your assessment agrees with this supposedly INFJ-generated theory in regard to INTP, but not INTJ. Many see the expectation of anything warm and cuddly inside INTJs as wishful thinking. The "warm and fuzzy" designation, however, is reserved for NFs.

    INFJ - cold on outside, warm and fuzzy on the inside
    INFP - warm and fuzzy inside and out
    INTP - warm on the outside, hard as a rock inside
    INTJ - cold and hard inside and out
    In any case, my comment was meant as a joke.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  7. #77
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    Okay then. I've gotten around to this. These days I don't attempt much typological analysis as I've become rather disenchanted with it, but I'll put my two cents in.

    I think his description of INTJs as being more narrow and focused and INTPs as more broad and unfocused is very accurate. It's the most accurate part of this.

    In my experience INTPs do seem to be less tough-minded than INTJs, but I'm not sure I can get on board with his explanation. This is due to my own personal battle the the MBTI theory about the third and fourth processes. I never liked them as I always felt they restricted the number of possible permutations without any really good inferred explanation for why.

    Some questions popped into my head during the video.

    INTPs are more likely to seek information only when it is needed, but what when is information considered needed? It's open-ended enough that I'm not sure how to work with that one.

    How different is it to have a perception that is an idealized delusion and to make weak judgments on too little information? Externally, I suspect these two mistakes would often look the same.

    This last thing is probably going to sound like I'm just dissing INTJs, but I was quite skeptical of this one. Are INTJs really more empirical? To me it seems like ENTJs and ISTJs are more empirical than INTPs, but INTJs are even less empirical. This is not without possible explanation either. Te should be more empirical than Ti, yes, but perhaps the fact that the INTJ relies more on the powers of Ni (which I dare say is the least empirical process possible) mitigates that advantaged of Te (whereas an ENTJ's leading Te is largely allowed to do its thing) in actual day to day performance.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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  8. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Okay then. I've gotten around to this. These days I don't attempt much typological analysis as I've become rather disenchanted with it, but I'll put my two cents in.

    I think his description of INTJs as being more narrow and focused and INTPs as more broad and unfocused is very accurate. It's the most accurate part of this.

    In my experience INTPs do seem to be less tough-minded than INTJs, but I'm not sure I can get on board with his explanation. This is due to my own personal battle the the MBTI theory about the third and fourth processes. I never liked them as I always felt they restricted the number of possible permutations without any really good inferred explanation for why.

    Some questions popped into my head during the video.

    INTPs are more likely to seek information only when it is needed, but what when is information considered needed? It's open-ended enough that I'm not sure how to work with that one.

    How different is it to have a perception that is an idealized delusion and to make weak judgments on too little information? Externally, I suspect these two mistakes would often look the same.

    This last thing is probably going to sound like I'm just dissing INTJs, but I was quite skeptical of this one. Are INTJs really more empirical? To me it seems like ENTJs and ISTJs are more empirical than INTPs, but INTJs are even less empirical. This is not without possible explanation either. Te should be more empirical than Ti, yes, but perhaps the fact that the INTJ relies more on the powers of Ni (which I dare say is the least empirical process possible) mitigates that advantaged of Te (whereas an ENTJ's leading Te is largely allowed to do its thing) in actual day to day performance.
    I don't particularly disagree with the content, but the wording of this last paragraph amused me, as if 'empirical' was a great and desired virtue.

  9. #79
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonnyboy View Post
    I assure you, by offering to provide my reasons for perceiving you the way that I do, I was being courteous. To the extent that a person cares about how others perceive her, she might wish, from time to time, to receive feedback with supporting evidence. This goes beyond a concern with image though, since our words and style have a profound influence on whether others are receptive to what we say, and to what extent we affect their lives. Those effects can be as small as putting someone in a poor mood for a time, or as large as opening them up to life changing information/experiences.
    There's your problem right there.
    When I want feedback, I ask for it. You'll find unsolicited feedback is seldom appreciated. The opinion of most people is a matter of indifference to me. You might think that's arrogant, I could care less. There are people who appreciate my sense of humour and direct style, and people who don't get me at all. Can't please everyone. Don't wanna.
    I'm not arrogant enough to suppose I have a "profound influence" on anyone. Nor am I interested in influencing /affecting anyone. The thought of that makes me shudder. If being disagreeable makes me less likely to influence others, that's an argument for being disagreeable. /INTP
    I don’t know how I can convince you that I’m not a troll.
    It's very simple, just stop trolling me.
    I'll accept your explanation / apology for now. A more cynical person might suppose that you turned the discussion onto me to provoke the usual pile-on by other weak-minded types. Which, true to form, is what happens. When you insult someone, there are, unfortunately, some rather pathetic characters who lack the courage to stand alone but nevertheless like to grind their axe in public, chomping at the bit to stick the knife in.

    It's one of the most contemptible things about human nature.
    So, I guess if you ever pull a stunt like this again, we'll both know exactly where we stand.

    What does it mean for your internal dialogue to be “a business of mine”?
    This derail started with your "impersonation" of my internal dialogue. A complete misrepresentation of me, and in fact, just a reflection of your own insecurities. I'm frankly, sick and tired of being penalised for other people's insecurities and inferiority complexes.
    the way you approach people is unique, and I suppose I don’t have a good sense of why you say some of the things that you do. You are well read, well spoken, but very harsh. You have interesting things to say.

    I don’t want a reaction from you. If you were banned from the forum I would be one of the people fighting for your reinstatement, as I’ve done with many others. I want to learn from you, and I believe that ultimately your intentions are good, even if the mods don’t always see it that way. For me, learning from someone is aided by learning about her as well. Context.

    As for putting anyone on ignore, I don’t see the point. What good would come of it?
    I guess you will have to take the rough with the smooth then. I am harsh. But I am fair.

    It seems to me that you are asking something of me and offering in return nothing but premature judgement, insults and public lecturing. Seem like a fair exchange to you?

    If you genuinely want to get to know someone/what they're thinking, there are better ways to go about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by RaptorWizard View Post
    but you shouldn't act like a dog
    Whereas acting like a deranged lizard is just the ticket, I suppose?

    The hypocrisy and self-delusion exhibited in this thread is truly astounding.

    In case you were wondering, it's not ok to insult someone because of something someone else IMAGINED they were thinking to themselves. I mean, it would be funny if it wasn't such a PITA derail. How do people manage to justify their double-standards to themselves?
    Case in point:
    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    I believe that those who feel the need to call others stupid/illogical/irrational are insecure. It's projection of the shadow self onto another person, for the purpose of destroying it.
    And in the next breath:
    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    INTP's look personable and human on the outside and inside are made of cold, calculating titanium.
    So calling people irrational is unconscionable (bad Jung!), but calling them callous and inhuman, well, that's just helpful feedback.

    If I had a heart, and/or thought the greenfairy ever knew what it was talking about, I might take offence at that.
    As it is...
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  10. #80
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Though much of the comparison (between INTP and INTJ) has merit, Dawkins is INTJ, so it's misapplied. "The God Delusion" is a polemical rant, as are all of his anti-religious programmes. I couldn't get all the way through it, it was so toxic. They're both batshit crazy, but Hitchins is funnier.
    A better comparison would be Alain de Botton (almost certainly an INTP) who wrote Religion for Atheists. He explains his "kinder, gentler" (wittier) view here:

    http://www.ted.com/talks/alain_de_bo...heism_2_0.html
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

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