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Thread: Is Ni like Fi?

  1. #61
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    I think Fi and Ti are more subjectively decisive. Means when they spit out analysis or facts they are pretty convinced about them being right and need hard counter facts to be convinced otherwise. Te is more objective and in combination with Ni it has a very detached and objective way to present facts and information. Can be easily convinced of the fact being wrong tho, if not multiple arguements prove them right. In that sense NiTe is more scientific in its approach, while NeTi or NeFi goes deeper, is more subjective and special to the case at hand.

    If you could say that FiNe would resemble Ni, well then you wouldnt need 8 functions.
    Not to beat a dead typec horse, but once Ni locks on to something, it's pretty convinced about it being right too.
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    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Not to beat a dead typec horse, but once Ni locks on to something, it's pretty convinced about it being right too.
    yea 'once'. Regarding dragging things on a personal level tho, I think TiNe or FiNe does beat NiTe anytime. While Fi would get emotional, Ti would deem the intercolutor as dumb rather instead of admitting they were wrong.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

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    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    yea 'once'. Regarding dragging things on a personal level tho, I think TiNe or FiNe does beat NiTe anytime. While Fi would get emotional, Ti would deem the intercolutor as dumb rather instead of admitting they were wrong.
    Not really sure what you're saying. All functions have their purpose and place.
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    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    yea 'once'. Regarding dragging things on a personal level tho, I think TiNe or FiNe does beat NiTe anytime. While Fi would get emotional, Ti would deem the intercolutor as dumb rather instead of admitting they were wrong.
    Not really sure what you're saying. All functions have their purpose and place.
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  5. #65
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Not really sure what you're saying. All functions have their purpose and place.
    Well if someone would ask me, who is more stubborn: intp or intj ? Or infp or infj ? I'ld usually go with the p-types. Since they have Ti or Fi it says about those functions that a subjective element is strong in them. Since T and F are the judging functions, they are the ones which decide from what was perceived. So while a INTJ could start seeing things on the World that just aint there or may are there but only he sees them, an intp could start to believe he is the only one to decide right about things cause the rest of the World is dumb.

    Thats the difference I mean between subjective and objective function, I is subjective and E is objective. And while a Ne user is connecting the dots and forming images of understanding to process the perceived, a Ni user could be adding dots to perceive what he wants to perceive. While a Te user makes a list of pro and con, while a Ti user says 'I've been right on this for 10 years, why should I be wrong now?'.

    Pretty hard to explain for me.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

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    If Fi is similar to any perceiving function, it's Si.

    i.e. "that's the way...I like it...uh huh uh...that's the way...I like it."

    And others not in the know may be mystified of the strength of you preferring it that way.


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    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    If Fi is similar to any perceiving function, it's Si.
    agreed. a subjective set of fervent yet vague standards that makes anyone who doesn't have it think "wtf?"
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    I think Ni is very aware. It has the ability to turn things and look at what it wants, from what angle etc. I don't doubt it uses all other functions as its slave to do this, and I also don't doubt that it is primarily motivated to perceive in its unique way. But I believe it is fully in charge, navigating, positioning, deciding, and ultimately gate-keeping on what my personal psyche locks on to.
    I think we become more aware that we have this tendency and can kind of begin to mould ourselves and our actions consciously by paying attention of what is paid attention to..but perhaps the conclusions, subsequent opinions and directions we take are actually governed by the aux fe. When there are so many ways to perceive things and so many different ramifications for actions to pick what is the best way to navigate in life I always consider the human impact of my views and actions and the not so apparent implications and how I think things would affect people as a whole. I would attribute that to Fe. No man's an island and ideas are powerful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmotini View Post
    If Fi is similar to any perceiving function, it's Si.

    i.e. "that's the way...I like it...uh huh uh...that's the way...I like it."

    And others not in the know may be mystified of the strength of you preferring it that way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    agreed. a subjective set of fervent yet vague standards that makes anyone who doesn't have it think "wtf?"
    I think Si works pretty much the same as Ni.

    To spell it out, here’s how I described Ni in an earlier post:

    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    Well, my understanding of Ni is that it works like a matrix or a spiderweb. The Ni-user collects factoids and data in their Ni matrix, sees how they all connect together, and then churns the matrix and rearranges the factoids and data into new combinations. He compares the new combination against the old, churns again for more combinations, and thus cranks out plans and back-up plans and more back-up plans, until a solution is worked out.
    As I see it Si works the same in that it gathers data and factoids into groups and categories, juggles them around to check out their similarities and dissimilarities, and then extracts the best features or qualities or rules from that group or set. And then proceeds to the next group or category, or creates new sets and groups from older ones.

    So it’s kind of like the churning of Ni, IOW, like putting a bunch of dice in a cup, shaking them up, and then spilling them out on a table to see what combination comes out. Except that where Ni is about matrices and juxtapositioning, Si is about aggregations and comparisons for similarities and dissimilarities.

    In general I see Si as the use of various mnemonic/analytical/storage devices. A simple real-world example would be the Dewey Decimal System (the filing system used in libraries and bookstores), where books are first analyzed according to their qualities and features (their subject matter) and aggregated into categories and sub-categories accordingly; and only afterwards are they organized by alphabet within the categories. Storage of computer files often works this way on PCs: Use of folders and sub-folders to store material by subject category, and then by alphabet within the folder itself.

    Scientists categorize plants and animals by analyzing their features and qualities and then aggregating them in taxonomies on that basis.

    Another example: When I was translating, I often wouldn’t use the big universal dictionaries that students use. My best tools were glossaries on specific subjects, where terms could be defined in a tight context and compared with other terms in that same context. Again, the essense of a glossary is the aggregation of a subset of terms for a laser-like focus on that one particular category of terms.

    As for my personal experience of Si: I haven’t done a lot of reading on Si, so I’m not sure how much this corresponds with typology canon. But it’s my tertiary function, i.e., one of my stronger ones.

    Over time I have developed various mnemonic devices for comparing features of data in order in order to aggregate them for storage or memory; they allow me to keep track of large volumes of data and information and retrieve it quickly. Playing with these things seems to be something I’m naturally good at. When I explain those devices to others, they tell me I’m using my Ti or Te to develop an organizational structure. But Ti is my eighth and weakest function, and my Te doesn’t work on this kind of detailed level; with these Si-based mnemonic/analytical/storage devices, I get kind of an anal-retentive thrill that’s different from the Te organizational thrill.

    I’ll also add that I *don’t* believe Si has much to do with simple memory (which every type has, of course) or with free association (like a taste or smell unexpectedly evoking a scene from childhood, and which happens to every type as well).

    To sum up: I think Si is like Ni (more of a structured data-crunching and churning faculty) as opposed to being a simple mechanism like memory or free association.

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    Just to fill out the picture, I might as well extrapolate to Ti. That is, if Si is related to Ni, then Ti is probably related to Fi.

    Concerning Fi, I said:

    Quote Originally Posted by FineLine View Post
    To me, Fi is made up of a bunch of “stories” or ideals that I’ve constructed in my head over time: For example: Poor underdog being abused by more powerful people; drug-addled homeless dude; hard-working salt-of-the-earth type who can’t get a break; and so on.

    I have hundreds of these little stories in my head, some very detailed, and some kind of vague and generalized. As I go through my day, I’m constantly checking the outside impressions that are coming in via Ne against the Fi “stories” or ideals in my head. At the simplest level, those “stories” or ideals give me quick context with which to make quick judgements: I like that guy, I pity that guy, I hate that guy; or that's unfair, that's fair, etc.

    (IOW, as I understand it we Fi-users don’t really empathize directly with people. Instead we have favorite ideals or stories or models in our head, and we connect with various individuals in the world around us to the extent that the individuals appear to match those ideals or stories already in our head.)
    So presumably Ti-users would build a library of logical/analytical models and principles, some of them very painstaking and detailed. When an interesting problem comes up, they quickly thumb through their library of models and find the best match of logical principle or model to the problem at hand.

    Of course their models would have to be updated frequently. As in the field of law, the principles remain the same but their application to real-world issues requires constant re-evaluation.

    Ti is my weakest function, so I’m largely extrapolating from what I already said about Fi, Ni, and Si. But Ti-users are free to comment.

    **************

    As for the extraverted equivalents of all these functions: I would say that they are pretty similar to the introverted versions, but more ad hoc and freewheeling. The extraverted functions are like practical scientists operating in the field and working with whatever raw material comes to hand, whereas introverts take their work back to their inner lab and work on it in ideal conditions, away from the disruptions of real life.

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