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  1. #11
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    aggregating details not pushing them away. constantly weaving together algorithms. the world is your oyster.

  2. #12
    4x9 cascadeco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    aggregating details not pushing them away. constantly weaving together algorithms. the world is your oyster.
    "...On and on and on and on he strode, far out over the sands, singing wildly to the sea, crying to greet the advent of the life that had cried to him." - James Joyce

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  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctorjuice View Post
    So I understand that Ni is mostly pushing away details to perceive the core idea behind something, the meaning behind the surface appearance. How is this subjective though? I understand how all the other introverted functions are except for Ni.
    There isn't a reason for it, it just is.

    All introverted functions deal in the subjective; all extraverted deal in the objective.

    All of the functions are subjective and instinctual, but we can still see much of how they work from the outside.

    Knowing this, you then can break things down into:

    What does objective perception mean?

    What does subjective judgement mean?

    etc, etc

    Then all you have to do is distinguish Ti from Fi, etc.

    EDIT:

    So I suppose you could see how Ni is subjective by looking at introverted perception. One major part of this process is that subjective symbols are recalled; but not in a sensation kind of way, in an intuiting kind of way.

  4. #14
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riva View Post
    Ni conclusions are based on facts (picked by Se) are they not? Ni doesn't try to formulate answers therefore never asks itslef whether 'there is more?' More the facts, better the Ni and it changes its point of view from time to time (easily adaptable) when Se presents Ni with more facts.

    So yes it is subj............
    This explains why, in many ways, Ni dominate types need to get out and experience things a bit more so they can get a few more 'facts' to work on.

    Ive wondered if Ni starts to stagnate if the person isn't progressing so it isn't fed new options and peters out?

    Of course that could be said of any functional order....and of any type.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

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  5. #15
    Senor Membrae Eugene Watson VIII's Avatar
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    I think it's because it's not necessarily true. Without Te fidgeting with the sides of the Ni model, Ni is subjective because the thinking does not necesarilly point out anything that exists in the world. When you see a face in the cloud, others will just pass it off as a cloud. I think that explains it a bit.

    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Perception of perception itself.
    This, essentially
    Myers-Briggs: xsFP

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  6. #16
    Supreme High Commander Andy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctorjuice View Post
    So I understand that Ni is mostly pushing away details to perceive the core idea behind something, the meaning behind the surface appearance. How is this subjective though? I understand how all the other introverted functions are except for Ni.
    It gets eaaser to understand once you realise Ni isn't subjective because Ni doesn't encourage people to have opinions on maters of taste. It is, however, rooted in personal judgement. An strong Ni user may reach a conclusion as to haw something works, but we tend to be much slower descided if something is good or bad. That's why it is an irrational function - it is concerned with base reality more than the intelectual structures we build upon it. It's the Ji functions that deal with subjective opinions, whether it is technical worth (Ti) or social/emotional worth (Fi).

    Incidentally, the extroverted functions are neither subjective nor objective - they are simply the urge to act based upon what the user believes to be true. It is the underlying beliefs, based in Ji, where the subjectivity lies. EJs are often unaware of their own subjectivity due to the inferior Ji.
    Don't make whine out of sour grapes.

  7. #17
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    all introverted functions are subjective because they leave stuff out, thus creating an subjective view of something.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oakysage View Post
    The submergence of subjective perception in living one's life. Because the Ni user lives in the symbolic aspect, without judgement the life becomes a numerous amount of symbolic entities only understandable to Ni user. It is subjective in the sense that it falls under the perception of the Ni individual.
    Makes sense.

  9. #19
    Unapologetic being Evolving Transparency's Avatar
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    -Tangent - The other day I saw someone say that the function that they least liked was immature Ni....does anyone have an example of that? I just have an impression of Ni being labeled as "weird"...at least I label mine as that...Does that mean mine is immature?

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    It gets eaaser to understand once you realise Ni isn't subjective because Ni doesn't encourage people to have opinions on maters of taste. It is, however, rooted in personal judgement. An strong Ni user may reach a conclusion as to haw something works, but we tend to be much slower descided if something is good or bad. That's why it is an irrational function - it is concerned with base reality more than the intelectual structures we build upon it. It's the Ji functions that deal with subjective opinions, whether it is technical worth (Ti) or social/emotional worth (Fi).

    Incidentally, the extroverted functions are neither subjective nor objective - they are simply the urge to act based upon what the user believes to be true. It is the underlying beliefs, based in Ji, where the subjectivity lies. EJs are often unaware of their own subjectivity due to the inferior Ji.
    According to jung, all of the functions live in the realm of the collective unconscious. That makes them all pretty subjective.

    Although to better fill what you mean, jung defines the introverted attitude as subjective due it its relation with the object.

    EDIT: Oh, you mean that kind of subjectivity. I thought you were using Jung's language. My bad.

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