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  1. #31
    Senior Member The Great One's Avatar
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    @EJCC

    Subdoing your Te? If you are subduing your Te then you are then using another function what the hell? Are you sure you aren't an ESFJ?

  2. #32
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    EJCC

    Subdoing your Te? If you are subduing your Te then you are then using another function what the hell? Are you sure you aren't an ESFJ?
    No, I am not an ESFJ.

    The bolded is false. By "subduing my Te", I do not mean turning it off entirely. Like I said before (if you read my post all the way through), you can use Te as your dominant function and not be an asshole. If I didn't subdue my Te, I would just tell people exactly how they are wrong, whenever I felt like it, regardless of how much I was stepping over their feelings and/or regardless of how I may be ruining my chances of achieving my goals* by doing so.

    Te does not have to exist without tact and respectfulness -- both of which, in my opinion, are not function related.

    *e.g. by being so blunt with them about something they're doing wrong, that their chances of changing their ways and doing things the right way get significantly lower, entirely because of my behavior.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Actually if you are too nice there is a good probability that the people will think that you are being manipulative or that you are gay.
    Your post is very interesting, especially this part. Thanks again.

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    and/or regardless of how I may be ruining my chances of achieving my goals* by doing so.

    Te does not have to exist without tact and respectfulness -- both of which, in my opinion, are not function related.

    *e.g. by being so blunt with them about something they're doing wrong, that their chances of changing their ways and doing things the right way get significantly lower, entirely because of my behavior.
    Yeah.

    We tend to speak of utility, pragmatism, organization, goals, and results when we speak of Te. It's not difficult to grasp the concept that, sometimes, not being a dick is the most effective and pragmatic way to achieve results.

  4. #34
    this is my winter song EJCC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bologna View Post
    Yeah.

    We tend to speak of utility, pragmatism, organization, goals, and results when we speak of Te. It's not difficult to grasp the concept that, sometimes, not being a dick is the most effective and pragmatic way to achieve results.
    Very true! I hadn't thought about it that way, but that's definitely true.
    ~ g e t f e s t i v e ! ~


    EJCC: "The Big Questions in my life right now: 1) What am I willing to live with? 2) What do I have to live with? 3) What can I change for the better?"
    Coriolis: "Is that the ESTJ Serenity Prayer?"



    ESTJ - LSE - ESTj (mbti/socionics)
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    want to ask me something? go for it!

  5. #35
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    On the other hand, even Fe people will keep pushing and pushing passive-aggressively if you don't lay down the fucking law with them and create boundaries. They'll keep doing their shit as long as you play Fi/Pe (Pe/Fi) "nice" and once they get a OHAI SURPRISE dose of Te, they will stop their shit.

    Te can be detached and reasonable though. I think that's mature Te. Te that's not childish can just come across as kind of impersonal and even-handed and matter of fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    Focus on communicating the facts without creating a caricature in your mind about the "stupidity" of other people. When facts are communicated in a socially and emotionally demeaning manner, rather than a clear, objective manner, people get insulted. It's not the facts, but the need for social dominance that offends others. I would say to Te doms who often offend to step back and get a clear sense of where your literal objectivity about the facts ends and where your personal need to be right and superior to others begins.
    Quote Originally Posted by bologna View Post
    We tend to speak of utility, pragmatism, organization, goals, and results when we speak of Te. It's not difficult to grasp the concept that, sometimes, not being a dick is the most effective and pragmatic way to achieve results.
    Yes. The essence of Te is objective detachment, at least to the extent humanly possible. The focus is on facts and goals, cause and effect. One can indeed present these with respect and courtesy, and that will usually get better results. Sometimes, though, even the most gentle presentation is met with resistance, often very emotional resistance. That's when Marmie's first paragraph comes into play: not rudeness exactly, but an approach that is more deliberately blunt, without the veneer of politeness.

    In any case, the effective Te user applies it to his/her own ideas and actions, and not just to those of others.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #36
    Senior Member Winds of Thor's Avatar
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    I think if I used Te I would be embarrassed sounding off around people. So a couple ideas..
    A.) Discuss whatever privately, or
    B.) Work really hard and learn to think internally.
    "..And the eight and final rule: If this is your first time at Fight Club, you have to fight."
    'Men are meant to be with women. The rest is perversion and mental illness.'

  7. #37
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Yes. The essence of Te is objective detachment, at least to the extent humanly possible. The focus is on facts and goals, cause and effect. One can indeed present these with respect and courtesy, and that will usually get better results. Sometimes, though, even the most gentle presentation is met with resistance, often very emotional resistance. That's when Marmie's first paragraph comes into play: not rudeness exactly, but an approach that is more deliberately blunt, without the veneer of politeness.

    In any case, the effective Te user applies it to his/her own ideas and actions, and not just to those of others.
    From what I have read in your posts, you are an effective applied example of what you are describing here. I agree that some people respond badly to detached analysis however politely presented, so there reaches a point where a person has to decide how much of the result of successful communication is their responsibility. If you want a specific result, then further diplomatic measures are needed, but if not, then it makes sense to decide where to draw the line.

    The issues related to F based hypocrisy, falseness, and imposing ideals are thoroughly discussed and examined, but there are parallels to each of these tendencies from a T based perspective which are also worth calling out. This false objectivity that is based in personal ego makes claims which are assumed even more universal that a F based sense of universal morality. There are numerous historical examples of this misapplied logic and reason that was used as a means to establish dominance. Ego has no place in objectivity and it is the very foundation of subjective thinking. This is why when statements of arrogance accompany claims to objectivity, there can be fragmented strains of logic, but the foundation can be more deeply subjective than any thinking done by a person called a Feeler.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  8. #38
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fia View Post
    The issues related to F based hypocrisy, falseness, and imposing ideals are thoroughly discussed and examined, but there are parallels to each of these tendencies from a T based perspective which are also worth calling out. This false objectivity that is based in personal ego makes claims which are assumed even more universal that a F based sense of universal morality. There are numerous historical examples of this misapplied logic and reason that was used as a means to establish dominance. Ego has no place in objectivity and it is the very foundation of subjective thinking. This is why when statements of arrogance accompany claims to objectivity, there can be fragmented strains of logic, but the foundation can be more deeply subjective than any thinking done by a person called a Feeler.
    Te is not off the hook for imposing idea(l)s. Te may be certain of its facts and logic, but cannot be certain of someone else's values and priorities unless they have been clearly communicated. That's why we can easily THINK we know the best course of action for someone else, but ultimately be off the mark.

    The detachment of Te should set aside most concerns of ego. When it does not, something else is certainly in play. Of course, something else is always involved, since our functions do not operate in a vacuum. The best we can do is to be able to identify what is objective about our position, and what is subjective. All of this presupposes that those "objective facts" are indeed accurate, otherwise it's garbage in - garbage out. Both of these concerns - sorting the objective from the subjective, and checking one's facts - relate to the last comment of my last post, namely using Te on oneself.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  9. #39
    Sweet Ocean Cloud SD45T-2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great One View Post
    @EJCC

    Subdoing your Te? If you are subduing your Te then you are then using another function what the hell? Are you sure you aren't an ESFJ?
    What she's describing is discipline/maturity.
    1w2-6w5-3w2 so/sp

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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Just as the MBTI says: I am socally insensitive version of you.
    So when you mix your drive with strong introversion the above post is exactly what you wll get.


    (but I am pretty sure I am but trully evil ... I am just naturally pretty blunt)
    I personally tend to get an insensitive or tough impression often with feeling-inferior types, especially IxTP. Depending some of our Te and Fi can seem pretty balanced.

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