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  1. #1
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    Exclamation MBTI types with an X - something doesn't sit well with me...

    i noticed some people here have an x in their MBTI type, i am guessing representing that they either feel they are "in the middle", "both"... and something doesn't make sense to me:

    let's take an ENxP:
    both ENTP & ENFP have the same dominant & inferior functions...

    but then we have a huge difference:

    ENTP:
    Auxiliary: Introverted Thinking
    Tertiary: Extraverted Feeling

    ENFP:
    Auxiliary: Introverted Feeling
    Tertiary: Extraverted Thinking

    it's not just a question here about whether they are more F or more T, they would have to be perfectly balanced on 3 dimensions:
    1) between introverted thinking and extroverted thinking
    2) between introverted feeeling and extroverted feeling
    3) between their auxilary function and their tertiary function

    can anyone of the ENxPs testify that this really applies to them?

    how about an ExTP same aux & ter functions, but now it gets worst, not only do they need to be:
    1) perfectly balanced between introverted sensing and extroverted sensing
    2) perfectly balanced between introverted intuition and extroverted intuition
    but also:
    3) perfectly balanced between their dominant function and their inferior function

    this pretty much goes on to all MBTI types with x's... what am i missing? how can that possibly make sense?

  2. #2
    Member tine5's Avatar
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    Oh, well with mine that's not the case at all. The X means I'm unsure I'm learning the functions of Se and Ne and found that no one could explain them so they actually seemed different without stereotyping! I've had a great person tell me a bit more abou them and done a questionnaire or three and got Se, so it's probably that, I'm just waiting to be sure!!

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by tine5 View Post
    Oh, well with mine that's not the case at all. The X means I'm unsure I'm learning the functions of Se and Ne and found that no one could explain them so they actually seemed different without stereotyping! I've had a great person tell me a bit more abou them and done a questionnaire or three and got Se, so it's probably that, I'm just waiting to be sure!!
    i see... and i think i can help with only one question:
    are you more absorbed in the details around you for what they are or for what they remind you of?

  4. #4
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    X just means unknown, even tho some people dont get that
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  5. #5
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    I use a lower case x for an unsure trait and an upper case X for balanced one. Also for an X in the E/I dimension, there's not much to it. For instance, an XSTP would use Ti and Se equally, as well as Ni and Fe equally.

    An X in the J/P dimension however...
    Thinkist: not optimist nor pessimist. I am primarily competent in the enneagram.
    SX 9w1, SP 5w6, SP 3w4 | Split with the first two
    Ti-Se-Si-Ni-Te-Fi-Ne-Fe. I'm always questioning this, particularly the Si.
    Big 5/Global5/SLOAN: RCUEX

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    X just means unknown, even tho some people dont get that
    hmm.. it comes to me that without knowing their order, simply knowing which functions you have -if your intuition is introverted or extraverted and so on, you would be left with 4 options, and at least 2 of them won't share any letters at all.

    for example, if you know you have Fe, Si, Ne & Ti, your 4 options would be ESFJ/ISFJ/ENTP/INTP, so given the order is left unknown, you would still know nothing about your letters, since ESFJ and INTP don't share any letters at all (but have the same functions).

    so just from not knowing the order, it would basically be xxxx. or exsexsexsex... which means your ex has hooked up 3 times since the breakup. and that's just salt on open wounds man. why bring that up? why?! ok moving on...

    now let's say you know the functions, but not the order, but you do know the order within your judgement functions and/or within your perception functions, let's say you know that your Ti is greater then your Fe, in that case the only place you can have an X is in the start (xNTP).

    and among those functions, if you know the place of at least one of those functions, for example which function is dominant, or which one is inferior, then you know your entire MBTI type.

    if you know the order but not the functions, you would have two X's, for example if you know that your N>T>F>S you would have xNTx, or if you know your S>F>T>N, you would have xSFx. knowing one letter would tell you the other.

    i just don't see any one missing variable where you can have an X anywhere else but the start (except, you know, 3rd marriages, but they have a divorce rate higher then 70%)

  7. #7
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    hmm.. it comes to me that without knowing their order, simply knowing which functions you have -if your intuition is introverted or extraverted and so on, you would be left with 4 options, and at least 2 of them won't share any letters at all.

    for example, if you know you have Fe, Si, Ne & Ti, your 4 options would be ESFJ/ISFJ/ENTP/INTP, so given the order is left unknown, you would still know nothing about your letters, since ESFJ and INTP don't share any letters at all (but have the same functions).

    so just from not knowing the order, it would basically be xxxx. or exsexsexsex... which means your ex has hooked up 3 times since the breakup. and that's just salt on open wounds man. why bring that up? why?! ok moving on...

    now let's say you know the functions, but not the order, but you do know the order within your judgement functions and/or within your perception functions, let's say you know that your Ti is greater then your Fe, in that case the only place you can have an X is in the start (xNTP).

    and among those functions, if you know the place of at least one of those functions, for example which function is dominant, or which one is inferior, then you know your entire MBTI type.

    if you know the order but not the functions, you would have two X's, for example if you know that your N>T>F>S you would have xNTx, or if you know your S>F>T>N, you would have xSFx. knowing one letter would tell you the other.

    i just don't see any one missing variable where you can have an X anywhere else but the start (except, you know, 3rd marriages, but they have a divorce rate higher then 70%)
    Yes, especially the exsex thing. But some people might not be sure about the functions at all, but know that they are extraverts and intuitive, which would make them ENXX, now if they would look at it bit closer and find out that they are also T types, but unsure about J/P, they would be ENTX, not knowing if its dom Te aux Ni or Dom Ne aux Ti, because not understanding the functions properly, or they might in reality even be ESTJ with strong tert Ne, who knows? I know i dont because i dont know these people and not even sure if they even exist at all, but are just products of my imagination that im using as an example. However, im quite certain that there are other people in the real world who are like my imaginary friends i just made up.

    People often get confused about their type because of their persona, which is not the real personality, but a mask they learned to put in order to handle people, its like the false self in some other psychology text books. Some people not intune with their true self might confuse their persona with their real personality, even answer the test according to persona, not the real self, which would potentially give false results from the test(especially since newbs only look at stereotypes).
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Yes, especially the exsex thing. But some people might not be sure about the functions at all, but know that they are extraverts and intuitive, which would make them ENXX
    that makes sense in the Keirsey temperment model, where each letter actually means something on it's own...

    but in the MBTI, knowing that your an ENxx just tells you that your dominant is an extraverted something - while telling you nothing about what it actually is, and without knowing what is Ni & Ne and Si & Se as the prime examples of what MBTI means by intuition & sensing how could you tell that your intuition as defined by the MBTI is more dominant then your sensing as defined by the MBTI? other then that, ENxx's don't really share anything in common:
    Ne Ti Fe Si =ENTP
    Ne Fi Te Si =ENFP
    Fe Ni Se Ti =ENFJ
    Te Ni Se Fi =ENTJ

    i am getting a hint that keirsey really screwed people over by not coming up with his own type codes... where are the pitchforks?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Lol, i only have one x in my type but if i had it my way there would be two/three of them. I don't like the functions because when i have tried to apply it on this site, people have stepped in and told me that the example i'm giving is something else so my judgement is clouded/indecisive in this regard.

    The last few times I've taken the test I've got I-55%, N-55%, F-55%, P65% and on the socionics test i got INFj however previously I've bounced all over the place.

    Nowadays i try not to pay too much attention to the type of people and more of what they are writing about.


    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    Yes, especially the exsex thing. But some people might not be sure about the functions at all, but know that they are extraverts and intuitive, which would make them ENXX, now if they would look at it bit closer and find out that they are also T types, but unsure about J/P, they would be ENTX, not knowing if its dom Te aux Ni or Dom Ne aux Ti, because not understanding the functions properly, or they might in reality even be ESTJ with strong tert Ne, who knows? I know i dont because i dont know these people and not even sure if they even exist at all, but are just products of my imagination that im using as an example. However, im quite certain that there are other people in the real world who are like my imaginary friends i just made up.

    People often get confused about their type because of their persona, which is not the real personality, but a mask they learned to put in order to handle people, its like the false self in some other psychology text books. Some people not intune with their true self might confuse their persona with their real personality, even answer the test according to persona, not the real self, which would potentially give false results from the test(especially since newbs only look at stereotypes).
    I agree with this completely. I don't perceive the vibe i give off here (high Fe) to be similar with the vibe i give off IRL as i surround myself with a lot of ENT's so we don't do the mushy gooey stuff and this allows me to be comfortable.

    EDIT - Just to throw something else in the mix. I've just come across this post ..
    Quote Originally Posted by Nales View Post
    Seems logical that ISFPs would do this: strong personal impressions (Fi-dom) based on sensory things (Se).
    INFPs... I guess Fi coupled with Ne would instead give random bursts of outrage such as: "Oh my god, I just realized how people totally slaughter those poor baby seals! This just feels SO wrong!"
    So my strong personal impressions are when i'm visiting other cultures or viewing beautiful architecture or just standing outside looking at the stars contemplating yet feeling so insignificant in the grand scheme of things.
    Sensory - When i'm in nature sure, but seeing the door frame which hasn't moved in the last 3 years yet i still walk into it.
    Then the Fi with Ne .. That happens all the time. It's like the dots have connected even though it isn't relevant to whatever i'm doing at that particular moment.

    Can you see the kind of headf**k i get into??
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  10. #10
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    that makes sense in the Keirsey temperment model, where each letter actually means something on it's own...

    but in the MBTI, knowing that your an ENxx just tells you that your dominant is an extraverted something - while telling you nothing about what it actually is, and without knowing what is Ni & Ne and Si & Se as the prime examples of what MBTI means by intuition & sensing how could you tell that your intuition as defined by the MBTI is more dominant then your sensing as defined by the MBTI? other then that, ENxx's don't really share anything in common:
    Ne Ti Fe Si =ENTP
    Ne Fi Te Si =ENFP
    Fe Ni Se Ti =ENFJ
    Te Ni Se Fi =ENTJ

    i am getting a hint that keirsey really screwed people over by not coming up with his own type codes... where are the pitchforks?
    But you know, the reality is that both models are part of reality. Each letter means something on their own, but also functions play a deeper role to the letters.

    For example someone might be sure that he is an extravert, but has no idea about the functions. Not knowing the functions behind the extraversion, doesent remove the fact that he is an extravert. People new to the system often only look at the stereotypes of type profiles, this sort of method gives you some idea about your type, but many people can identify themselves with multiple type descripions, as they are just stereotypes about the types and many people are not the stereotypical people. Also they might relate to the deacriptions with their persona, as i already mentioned, which might make them unsure about a single letter. Like some INFJ being able to relate to both INFJ and ISFJ profiles, because his family has forced him to act(raised him) more like ISFJ, even tho its not the real personality of him. Making him unsure about the dominant function.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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