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  1. #81
    Senior Member Studmuffin23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cygnus View Post
    Agreed.


    It's funny how people express their attitudes on racism in this thread. At its core, the reason racism is "bad" isn't because it's "illogical."
    Logic doesn't have a "right or wrong." Logic has what is, and what isn't. If this were the 40s, racism would be what "is," and everybody would be defending it to the extent people abhor it today.
    The issue with racism is that it's unethical, plain and simple.

    It's about social context more than anything. If someone's a racist and that's a problem, the issue isn't that they're being stupid, it's that they're being a jerk. Of course all the people around here who so fervently claim to obey "no law but the law of teh Lojicks" will try to rationalize jerks as being inherently intellectually inferior to them, and while in the case of racism this is often the case, Logic isn't the reason racism is unfavorable.


    Many illogical people are dicks, but a highly logical person could also be a dick if the conditions were right. So, an INTJ has the same potential for being a racist as other types do.




    This whole thread wreaks of self-righteousness. Dickish people aren't stupid. You attribute behavior you don't like to stupidity.

    Hanlon's Razor says you should never attribute to malice what is easily explained by stupidity, but this has only caused people to wrongly interpret malice as stupidity.




    And it's funny how often people highlight "nonconformity" in INTJs as if it's a blindness to all outside systems of rationality. INTJs are blind to social sytems of hierarchy in social relations and power dynamics as defined by Fe because they're Fe-PoLR. They will, however, take every opportunity to conform to extrinsic systems of logic as defined by Te. So when the INTJs come in here and say "I hate racism because it's illogical," congratulations, you're professing your conformity to external systems of collective logic as defined by the majority. No shit you hate racism. Racism isn't a logical policy of the Establishment anymore. It's a policy of certain people and communities as defined by Fe, but so were many parts of the anti-racism movements.


    Folks, I'm in no way trying to imply I appreciate or condone racism. I make every effort I can to personally be as small of an ethnocentrist as I can. I'm one of the many glad that the system's been officially altered to discourage this kind of thing, because I likely wouldn't be able to move towards there on my own.

    But these are the MBTI facts and they don't lie.
    APT analysis. I had always sensed that problem but could never articulate it.
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  2. #82
    Member Gizmo's Avatar
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    Stereotypes can be applied to a group of people, but never to an individual. From a logical stand point supported by sociology there is a significant difference in over all racial behavior due to cultural differences. However such truth does not, and cannot apply to an individual of any race. I think in this particular matter there is a misunderstanding, as INTJs are typically misunderstood. Racism is defined by hatred or malice towards a particular race. This cannot apply towards cultural observations also known as sociology. It is irrational to not like someone or a group of people by where they are from, and or the color of their skin... That would be racism, but to point out statistical sociological facts is a matter of logical perspective... Not racism. If such topics are brought up around an INTJ it is possible that they will take on and argue within a perspective regardless of whether or not we support it, simply as a means of looking at something from a different point of view. Please Note I am by no means racist. For example look at the 16 MBTI personality types to put things into a new perspective. Each type is accompanied by its stereotypes, and yet YOU ARE NOT YOUR TYPE.... Capeesh?
    ~ Only your heart can poison your mind. ~

  3. #83
    Google "chemtrails" Bush Did 9/11's Avatar
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    The question's more the other way around, right? "Why are many racists INTJs (according to SF stats)?"
    J. Scott Crothers
    aka "Bush Did 9/11"
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  4. #84
    Member Gizmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jscrothers View Post
    The question's more the other way around, right? "Why are many racists INTJs (according to SF stats)?"
    Right? They have statistics, but where is the evidence and the source of which.
    ~ Only your heart can poison your mind. ~

  5. #85
    Google "chemtrails" Bush Did 9/11's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gizmo View Post
    Right? They have statistics, but where is the evidence and the source of which.
    The source is simply the responses to the poll from SF members. Shoddy evidence, of course, but

    My point is that the question should be flipped around. If we assume the stats are correct -- the logic's all wrong because the stats don't suggest that INTJs are racists; it suggests that racists are INTJs. The OP's question relies on the first suggestion, where instead it should rely on that second one.

    So, the question should be "Why are racists INTJs?" rather than "Why are INTJs so racist?"

    Semantics, yeah. Maybe. But that means that the question, as-is, is akin to "Have you stopped beating your wife?" And that's where all of the pushback in this thread comes from.


    edit: But yeah, no matter which way it's sliced, the stats are relatively bogus.
    J. Scott Crothers
    aka "Bush Did 9/11"
    Founder, Truthtology, est. 1952
    Prophet and Channel, God Almighty
    Author, the Holy scripture Elevenetics

    "Just as jet fuel cannot melt steel beams, so too cannot the unshakeable pillars of Truthtology ever be shaken, whether by man, nature, or evidence."
    - Elevenetics
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  6. #86
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jscrothers View Post
    The question's more the other way around, right? "Why are many racists INTJs (according to SF stats)?"
    More like "why do many racists claim to be INTJ?"
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...
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  7. #87
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    More like "why do many racists claim to be INTJ?"
    This is a good question.

    One answer could be that the intj desription both provides the ability to relate to for those racists who are lonely socially awkward losers who seldom get laid and provides traits they are attracted to such as planning, intelligence, master of all etc.

    In short they relate and they wanna be.

  8. #88
    respect the brick C.J.Woolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jscrothers View Post
    So, the question should be "Why are racists INTJs?" rather than "Why are INTJs so racist?"
    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    More like "why do many racists claim to be INTJ?"
    You could also ask, "Why do so many people who post on Internet discussion boards claim to be INTJ?"

  9. #89
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.J.Woolf View Post
    You could also ask, "Why do so many people who post on Internet discussion boards claim to be INTJ?"
    INTJs get a bad rap. Mature INTJs do a good job at keeping it real.

    If someone is claiming to be an INTJ on an INTJ message board, but isn't, and is demanding that all the genuine INTJs play by their rules, people should call them out on it. Otherwise, they're going to end up dictating the way things operate. Non-INTJs should be allowed to participate in the community, but they should not force everyone else to cater to their whims.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  10. #90
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by C.J.Woolf View Post
    You could also ask, "Why do so many people who post on Internet discussion boards claim to be INTJ?"
    We did.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

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