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  1. #81
    Ginkgo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I have no doubt about what I feel. And it even goes beyond that, it's a knowing.

    I'm in a room with a view of heaven too. (:
    If you know xyz then faith in xyz isn't necessary. Are you sure?

  2. #82
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    You are wrong. I know with 100% certainty.
    How do you know that what you feel is god's presence? How can you be sure that it cannot be something else? Please note that "I just do" would beg the question.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I know with 100% certainty.
    In your case that does not seem to mean much:
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    It's possible I'm brainwashed. I have logically accepted God and the Bible as truth. [...] We don't require concrete evidence as every piece to a puzzle be perfectly in place to KNOW something. Intuition is experienced as a KNOWING. I understand that doesn't necessarily make what I 'know' true, which is why I remain open and flexible as I receive new information.

  3. #83
    A window to the soul
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginkgo View Post
    If you know xyz then faith in xyz isn't necessary. Are you sure?
    According to the Bible, "faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see." (Hebrews 11:1).

    I walk by faith. Yes, I'm sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Many would consider the claim of any knowledge with 100% certainty illogical. What exactly do you mean when you say you "know"? Do you mean that your perception of God is a true representation of the universe and everyone who disagrees is wrong?
    Intuition. Faith. As an ENTP, Intuition is the language I speak.

    When Carl Jung was asked during a 1959 BBC interview if he believed in the existence of God, Jung replied, "I don't believe, I KNOW".

    Carl Jung said the following in the 1930's at a college seminar:
    "The truth is this, I have had the experience of being gripped by something that is stronger than myself, something that people call God. So, I will never say that I believe that God exists. I must say I KNOW God exists!"

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia - Intuition - Carl Jung's theory
    In Carl Jung's theory of the ego, described in 1921 in Psychological Types, intuition was an "irrational function", opposed most directly by sensation, and opposed less strongly by the "rational functions" of thinking and feeling. Jung defined intuition as "perception via the unconscious": using sense-perception only as a starting point, to bring forth ideas, images, possibilities, ways out of a blocked situation, by a process that is mostly unconscious.

    Jung said that a person in whom intuition was dominant, an "intuitive type", acted not on the basis of rational judgment but on sheer intensity of perception.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    How do you know that what you feel is god's presence?
    How can you be sure that it cannot be something else? Please note that "I just do" would beg the question.
    I am free. I have peace that surpasses all understanding. I have no doubts or fears about my faith. I feel love for even you. The void inside is completely filled. He carries me through the hardest times in my life. I am never alone.

    Like Jung, I had the experience of being gripped by something that is stronger than myself. God changed me in a moment. My life has never been the same.

    In your case that does not seem to mean much:
    The intuition comment that you quoted from me was actually part of Jung quotes I read regarding belief in God.

  4. #84
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    I am free. I have joy that surpasses all understanding. I have no doubts. I have no fears. I feel love for even you. The void inside is completely filled. [Something] carries me through the hardest times in my life. I am never alone.
    Not surprisingly, that was "I just do" in a few more words.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Like Jung, I had the experience of being gripped by something that is stronger than myself. God changed me in a moment. My life has never been the same.
    You can see the error here: "[...] something that is stronger than myself, something that people call God." Jung goes from the first something, basically an internal experience, to the second something, an external being. It is an abductive inference that only makes sense if one presupposes that there is a god and that this god acts in ways that may be experienced by someone like him in the way in which he experienced something.

    You may think that god is the best explanation for what you feel because you do presuppose these things, but even then your god is not the only explanation. It might be Manitou, Zeus or the Great Green Arkleseizure. You cannot and you do not know.

    Thanks for playing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    The intuition comment that you quoted from me was actually part of Jung's theory regarding belief in God.
    Wonderful. That changes absolutely nothing.

  5. #85
    A window to the soul
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    In your case that does not seem to mean much:
    Perhaps something got lost in translation. I was responding to @Rasofy's comment where he said, "I have a theory that you've been belt spanked to the point of brainwashing."
    That was one of several disrespectful comments I received in that thread. So when I said, "it's possible I'm brainwashed..." in response, I was validating Rasofy's opinion as a reasonable consideration; I could see why he might say that since he hasn't walked a mile in my shoes. I also understand he didn't intend any disrespect. My consideration, didn't change the fact that I'm 100% confident that God exists. You have not gone where I've been. You have not experienced what I've experienced. As Ne-Ti would have it, regardless of what I know, I remain flexible and open to information and truth.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Thanks for playing.
    I'm not playing games with you today.

  6. #86
    Senior Member Xyk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    ...regardless of what I think I know or how confident I am, I absolutely remain flexible to new information and the truth about everything.
    This part makes no sense. Absolute confidence means zero flexibility. If you think that there is a 100% chance that god exists as you imagine him, then there is a 0% chance that your feeling is a result of anything else. I don't know what you're trying to say here.
    MBTI: INTP (PNIT if you wanna put it in order of strength.)
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    Also, credit for my new avatar goes to this person. I found it on the google.

  7. #87
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    Perhaps something got lost in translation. I was responding to @Rasofy's comment where he said, "I have a theory that you've been belt spanked to the point of brainwashing."
    That was one of several disrespectful comments I received in that thread. So when I said, "it's possible I'm brainwashed..." in response, I was validating Rasofy's opinion as a reasonable consideration; I could see why he might say that since he hasn't walked a mile in my shoes. I also understand he didn't intend any disrespect. That didn't change the fact that I'm still 100% confident that God exists. You have not gone where I've been. You have not experienced what I've experienced. Yes, as Ne-Ti would have it, regardless of what I think I know or how confident I am, I absolutely remain flexible to new information and the truth (about everything).
    Good. Then we agree that in your case 'I know with 100% certainty' does not mean more than 'my best guess at the moment'.

  8. #88
    A window to the soul
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Good. Then we agree that in your case 'I know with 100% certainty' does not mean more than 'my best guess at the moment'.
    That does not bring justice to the truth of what God has done in my life; my experiences are real.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xyk View Post
    This part makes no sense. Absolute confidence means zero flexibility. If you think that there is a 100% chance that god exists as you imagine him, then there is a 0% chance that your feeling is a result of anything else. I don't know what you're trying to say here.
    That's not correct. I clearly stated where I stand.

  9. #89
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    I gave up trying to convince people Gods don't exist. As long as they are happy this way (and not killing people in name of their God), it's probably for their best. Cypher (Matrix) knows it better:


    ''Hey, that's disrespectful and/or judgemental''
    It is just how Rasofy views it. Sometimes truth hurts.
    -----------------

    A man builds. A parasite asks 'Where is my share?'
    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


    -----------------

  10. #90
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    Hah, so much smug self-satisfaction in this thread. On both sides.

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