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  1. #191
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    People normally think of salvation as just being saved from eternal darkness, but it's much more than that. God wants to save you everyday. God wants to save your cirucumstances. God wants to save your emotions from bitterness, unforgiveness, and hatred. God wants to save your mind from stress, worries, cares and the burden of anxiety. God wants to save your finances. God wants to save your body from sickness and disease. Because God loves you. (:
    Do you believe that fewer bad things than average happen to people that have the version of faith you adhere to?

  2. #192
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    People normally think of salvation as just being saved from eternal darkness, but it's much more than that. God wants to save you everyday. God wants to save your cirucumstances. God wants to save your emotions from bitterness, unforgiveness, and hatred. God wants to save your mind from stress, worries, cares and the burden of anxiety. God wants to save your finances. God wants to save your body from sickness and disease. Because God loves you. (:
    I hope God doesn't want to save us from cognitive dissonance because cognitive dissonance is the path to learning.

    However cognitive dissonance is emotionally painful so perhaps to save us from emotional pain, God also saves us from learning.

  3. #193
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    People normally think of salvation as just being saved from eternal darkness, but it's much more than that. God wants to save you everyday. God wants to save your cirucumstances. God wants to save your emotions from bitterness, unforgiveness, and hatred. God wants to save your mind from stress, worries, cares and the burden of anxiety. God wants to save your finances. God wants to save your body from sickness and disease. Because God loves you. (:
    Who is responsible for the existence of eternal darkness?

  4. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Who is responsible for the existence of eternal darkness?
    In Matthew 25:41 Jesus talks about hell being created for Satan/fallen angels (because Satan rebelled). God did not create Hell as a horrible place or for man, but once God removed his presence from hell, it became horrible because God's glory, grace, goodness, and love were removed from it.

    With that said, if man rejects God, then man will go to the only alternate place, which is completely void of God: hell.

    James 2:10 tells us, "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it." We have all broken God's Commandments, and since "the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord," (Romans 6:23) we are in need of a Savior. "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus." (Romans 3:23)

    "it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)

    C.S. Lewis, once stated, "I willingly believe that the damned are, in one sense, successful, rebels to the end; that the doors of hell are locked on the inside. All that are in Hell, choose it. Without that self-choice there could be no Hell. No soul that seriously and constantly desires joy will ever miss it. Those who seek find. To those who knock it is opened. And yourself, in a dark hour, may will [a grumbling] mood, embrace it. Ye can repent and come out of it again. But there may come a day when you can do that no longer. Then there will be no you left to criticize the mood..."

  5. #195
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    In Matthew 25:41 Jesus talks about hell being created for Satan/fallen angels (because Satan rebelled). God did not create Hell as a horrible place or for man, but once God removed his presence from hell, it became horrible because God's glory, grace, goodness, and love were removed from it.

    With that said, if man rejects God, then man will go to the only alternate place, which is completely void of God: hell.

    James 2:10 tells us, "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it." We have all broken God's Commandments, and since "the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord," (Romans 6:23) we are in need of a Savior. "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus." (Romans 3:23)

    "it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God - not by works, so that no one can boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9)

    C.S. Lewis, once stated, "I willingly believe that the damned are, in one sense, successful, rebels to the end; that the doors of hell are locked on the inside. All that are in Hell, choose it. Without that self-choice there could be no Hell. No soul that seriously and constantly desires joy will ever miss it. Those who seek find. To those who knock it is opened. And yourself, in a dark hour, may will [a grumbling] mood, embrace it. Ye can repent and come out of it again. But there may come a day when you can do that no longer. Then there will be no you left to criticize the mood..."
    If hell is horrible because god removed his presence from it, if breaking the law was bad because god wanted it so, if breaking the law is now okay because god had his son killed, then god made hell horrible, then god condemned those who broke the law and killed his son only to change his own stance on the self-invented notion of sin. What you are saved from is god's own bad ideas. He forgoes the whip and you think he deserves praise for that. Madness!

  6. #196
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    religion doesnt like lateral thinkers, so what am I supposed to do ? Either I dont like religion as well or I apple-polish them and pray for forgiveness.

    The options religions leaves you to choose from are black and white. My World tho is grey.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  7. #197
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    religion doesnt like lateral thinkers, so what am I supposed to do ? Either I dont like religion as well or I apple-polish them and pray for forgiveness.

    The options religions leaves you to choose from are black and white. My World tho is grey.
    The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath. That sounds like lateral thinking, its what you make of it. If you're predisposed to dislike religion or what you think underpins it then you'll not like it.

  8. #198
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    The sabbath was made for man, not man for the sabbath. That sounds like lateral thinking, its what you make of it. If you're predisposed to dislike religion or what you think underpins it then you'll not like it.
    Well I dont believe in predisposition. I believe in the power of belief and that you by believing in it can become anything you want. This opens up options for you to develop in life which religion would never grant you, because it condems everyone who doesnt believe.

    The most primordial fact I find frightening about religion is that it says that life on Earth is a challenge, which when you succeed will grant you passage to heaven. What if I already consider life as such a miracle composed of a trillion random variables which led to my existance and am thankful that I was granted it. And that I dont want to go to any heaven but that heaven to me is the challenge that is life ?

    Why do I need to be rewarded for something that I like and dont want to be rewarded for.

    The same logical fallacy applies to doomsday scientists. Why do doomsday scientists research doomsday ? When doomsday happens there aint anyone around nomore to tell that they were right in the first place ?
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  9. #199
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    Well I dont believe in predisposition. I believe in the power of belief and that you by believing in it can become anything you want. This opens up options for you to develop in life which religion would never grant you, because it condems everyone who doesnt believe.

    The most primordial fact I find frightening about religion is that it says that life on Earth is a challenge, which when you succeed will grant you passage to heaven. What if I already consider life as such a miracle composed of a trillion random variables which led to my existance and am thankful that I was granted it. And that I dont want to go to any heaven but that heaven to me is the challenge that is life ?

    Why do I need to be rewarded for something that I like and dont want to be rewarded for.

    The same logical fallacy applies to doomsday scientists. Why do doomsday scientists research doomsday ? When doomsday happens there aint anyone around nomore to tell that they were right in the first place ?
    Religion doesnt mean that to me, I've always believed that if you dont find paradise in this life you wont in any other.

  10. #200
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Religion doesnt mean that to me, I've always believed that if you dont find paradise in this life you wont in any other.
    Your fatalistic streak for hopeless romantic reminds me of Braveheart .

    Lately I found out that Mel Gibson made the movie Passion of Christ. I was kinda shocked to find out that all my american idols seem to be religious fanatics. I generally find this trend in America frightening. I mean I do tolerate belief, having grown up in a muslim quarter I quite early learned to cope with that. And everyone who has the "live and let live attitude" really is no problem to me. I even like endless debates about religion but still this fanatism which evolves from the arabian/western conflict is kinda startling. I dont really know if religion is worth that and I hope in the future that americans do find another cultural identity than only feeling united when Joyce Meyer speaks with her Botox lips or another war is waged.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

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