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  1. #51
    curiouser and curiouser bluestripes's Avatar
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    @CrystalViolet, @prplchknz -

    i was also in speech therapy for a month or two, but i was somewhere between five and seven. i didn't learn to talk until i was 3.5, almost four, because of a neurological disorder that was eventually diagnosed as cerebral palsy (it was not 100 percent certain and i made a complete recovery, owing to the efforts of my maternal grandfather and paternal grandmother). when i did, i started to use full sentences almost at once and, as my mom put it, "erupted". she used to call me chatterbox or motormouth - i am told i could talk loudly and excitedly for hours, and i guess it must have been incredibly hard to shut me up. but i still pronounced the "l" sound after broad/hard vowels as identical to the "y" in "young" and couldn't manage the rolling "r". it became guttural, more similar to the rhotic sound in german or yiddish.

    my parents took me to a speech therapist, who made me lie on a couch and inserted a strange tool underneath my tongue - it looked like a long spoon with a wooden ball attached to the end. i was told to expel my breath in a specific way to make it vibrate against the lower side of my tongue. i didn't like this because i would get dizzy with hyperventilation and the sessions could last an hour or two each, so it was difficult to stand up afterward. but once the sessions were over, the speech defect was gone.

    Quote Originally Posted by LunaLuminosity View Post
    Telling me the trash is overflowing is not the same as telling me to take out the trash, it's only a hint at such so don't act like it was something I was actually told
    this is the exact thing i can have trouble with. if someone says, "it is cold in here" - or, as in your example, "the trash is overflowing" - my first instinctive impulse is to understand it as a statement of fact. now, with more social experience and several comprehensive courses in pragmatics, i am aware that people may not say what they mean in situations like those, so i can arrive at the additional meaning rationally. "one usually wouldn't state the obvious without a reason. it's colder than usual in this room because the window is open. this should be connected to the window, then. does this person want me to close it?" but it's not natural for me, and feels forced.

    during one of our pragmatics classes, the tutor illustrated this with the following example. she said: imagine a situation where you are sitting on a bench and eating a cucumber. someone sits down next to you and asks, it is not a chocolate egg that you are eating, is it? how would you interpret it?

    i was perplexed and couldn't think of a response until she told us that the person would be (supposedly) asking for part of the cucumber. but that did not explain much. i still could not understand why one would want to go to such a length - the sentence sounded outlandish, and i couldn't imagine who on earth could say that or where. it seemed a little dishonest, too, an attempt to be selfish and rude (or what one would perceive as that) without appearing to be such. i thought, i would rather that person asked outright - not sure about others, but i would not have found anything objectionable about it. or, if one does believe one is acting in a rude or unacceptable manner, then why do so at all? just be silent.

    in the end i would probably give them the cucumber. but only to make them stop asking bizarre irrelevant questions. or because, now that we had started to talk about the cucumber, it would sound like a good idea to snap it in half and share.

    to be honest, i suspect that i was not the only person in the class who had this reaction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Owfin View Post
    To this day, I still cannot understand "quarter after" and "quarter till". I'm like "Just tell me the time!"
    i couldn't understand it either as a child but i am not sure when this stopped - possibly when i was fifteen or sixteen. those two expressions made me stumble over them. i first had to remember that "a quarter past seven" meant i had to think about that actual hour, whereas "a quarter to seven" meant i had to think of the hour before that; then i had to visualize a clock face with the hour hand on seven and the minute hand on fifteen, or with the hour hand on six and the minute hand on forty-five, respectively. may have had to do something else too. the result was that when my mom (who taught me english) would ask me to translate the time using one of these expressions, i would experience a sort of mental emptiness and just stare.
    "i love deadlines. i like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." (c) douglas adams

    "there are only two ways to live your life. one is as though nothing is a miracle. the other is as though everything is a miracle." (c) albert einstein

    "if only i could grow with my eyes - like these leaves - into the depth" (c) sergei esenin

    "god is in the details" (c) proverb

  2. #52
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    Yes, I can be literal at times... I think. I'm pretty sure what I'm saying at times is literal, but maybe it just seems literal to me because I usually speak more metaphorically.

  3. #53
    not to be trusted miss fortune's Avatar
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    same as asking "can you be figurative in speech and also an S?"

    similes, metaphors and strange comparisons are totally the best! especially if you can work in a few pop culture references and quote a movie or song as well... I rarely communicate off the forum without alluding to something else and I'm rather comfortable where I placed myself even if other people aren't
    “Oh, we're always alright. You remember that. We happen to other people.” -Terry Pratchett

  4. #54
    Tier 1 Member LunaLuminosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestripes View Post
    this is the exact thing i can have trouble with. if someone says, "it is cold in here" - or, as in your example, "the trash is overflowing" - my first instinctive impulse is to understand it as a statement of fact. now, with more social experience and several comprehensive courses in pragmatics, i am aware that people may not say what they mean in situations like those, so i can arrive at the additional meaning rationally. "one usually wouldn't state the obvious without a reason. it's colder than usual in this room because the window is open. this should be connected to the window, then. does this person want me to close it?" but it's not natural for me, and feels forced.

    during one of our pragmatics classes, the tutor illustrated this with the following example. she said: imagine a situation where you are sitting on a bench and eating a cucumber. someone sits down next to you and asks, it is not a chocolate egg that you are eating, is it? how would you interpret it?

    i was perplexed and couldn't think of a response until she told us that the person would be (supposedly) asking for part of the cucumber. but that did not explain much. i still could not understand why one would want to go to such a length - the sentence sounded outlandish, and i couldn't imagine who on earth could say that or where. it seemed a little dishonest, too, an attempt to be selfish and rude (or what one would perceive as that) without appearing to be such. i thought, i would rather that person asked outright - not sure about others, but i would not have found anything objectionable about it. or, if one does believe one is acting in a rude or unacceptable manner, then why do so at all? just be silent.

    in the end i would probably give them the cucumber. but only to make them stop asking bizarre irrelevant questions. or because, now that we had started to talk about the cucumber, it would sound like a good idea to snap it in half and share.

    to be honest, i suspect that i was not the only person in the class who had this reaction.
    Yeah I don't get these either..... these things aren't really what the phrases mean, they're just one thing they might lead to, and in the case of the cucumber and the chocolate egg, a pretty unrelated one. If someone said that to me, my interpretation would be that they were being silly, and I would answer "it is not a chocolate egg that you are eating, is it?" with "yes" to be ambiguously silly back
    Tune into Ventrilo weeknights between 6pm and 1am PST for continuation of universe dominating shenanigans and occassional type-related propaganda.........

  5. #55
    Probably Most Brilliant Craft's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skylights View Post
    ^ i wouldn't link creativity and literal to SJ/NP. SJ boyfriend is, in fact, more creative than i am (gasp). he thinks of funny little things i don't think of and he brainstorms like a boss. yet SJ boyfriend is still SJ and i am still NP.
    Well ideas are stored via Si, so it could have come from experience. Or he could simply be skillful with ideas and yet not prefer the process of ideation. It's been said a lot, but preferences=/=abilities.

    (or you could be bad at typing..)

    As an added data, I consider myself very literal.

  6. #56
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    Do you say spoonerism alot? I do, LOL. Actually, in truth I wonder how I manage to communicate all, my brain scrambles it up all the time. Maybe my mother dropped me on my head alot.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
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  7. #57
    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    I convolute things, but i realize i'm doing it but i can't stop rearagging the order there suppose to come out so i go put them in order yourself.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  8. #58
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    I'm with the counter-intuitive argument here. I think sensing dominance and auxiliary are perhaps better at handling those types of phrases.

    I don't see why being literal gets in the way of pattern seeking either. So my answer is yes.

  9. #59
    All Natural! All Good!
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    I tend to interpret things literally when they are meant metaphorically, and metaphorically when they are meant literally. I approximate meanings most of the time. As for cultural references, both current and past, I feel totally out of the loop most of the time they come up. As if I were born on a different planet and dropped into this one right before the conversation. Other people seem to have gathered so much information, perhaps passively, and memorized it. It seems in those situations like I did not absorb the information I was supposed to. It's the same with social conventions. I seem unaware of how I am "supposed" to interact. I am clumsy and by other people's standards, "awkward".
    Strychnine is all-natural,
    So strychnine is all good.
    It's Godly and righteous,
    So eat it, you should.
    Who are you to refuse nature's will?


    Don't use the multiquote; it was planted by the devil to deceive us.

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  10. #60
    Freaking Ratchet Rail Tracer's Avatar
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    Yes, depends on how I want my information, how I want to send out information, and who are the people giving the information.

    Generally, the more I am literal, the more I am wanting to give accurate information as "January 8 on Sunday" is easier to understand than "the beginning of the second week of January." The first case is to the point, the information is to the point. The second is just begging me to think, second week of January, the beginning day (Sunday,) so.... that day would be Sunday and the Sunday of that week is on the 8th. A whole lot of needless confusion if you ask me.

    Generally, if someone where to tell me to be somewhere by, say, 6PM, I'll be there by 6PM or earlier. Not 6:00:30PM not 6:01PM not 6:10PM.

    However, in some cases, when someone says to be at a place by 6PM, it is generally assumed people will be arriving a bit later (say 6:30PM.) But that is because people would generally assume that the exact timing to arrive at a party isn't exactly at that time, it is just a time to tell people to get ready around that time.

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