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  1. #21
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    I use Ne (I think).

    I come up with ideas by brainstorming, either with myself or other people. The process is akin to word association games. Each idea has the potential to lead to various other ideas and those ideas can then give other ideas..aah a bit like nuclear fission.

    If the ideas have to be generated for important stuff, it's definitely in a structured way and I'll try to stay focused, the main objectives in mind and make charts. I don't like this method, but it's how I can at least attempt to finish what I started. On the other hand, if it's for fun, then I just let the madness consume me. You never know where the ideas might take you.

  2. #22
    Babylon Candle Venom's Avatar
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    I posted this in another thread already, but it just seemed to be really relevant:

    I would venture that a lot of Ni people don't feel particularly "creative" in the modern day way as much as we are "novel". Creativity today seems to invoke the idea of being able to spawn 5 new ideas from every one, constant tinkering and recombination. Ni is more about a singular shift in perspective; a novel way of perceiving a data set by turning it on it's head. I'd compare it to taking a piece of paper with a design on it: you can extrapolate the design and make it more creative or you can see that the original design is actually a picture of bil murry

  3. #23
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    I use Ne, I think. Sometimes I'm not thinking about much at all. But sometimes if I get on a topic or something happens that stimulated my mind, the thoughts come rushing at me all at once. It's just like a hurricane/ tornado of thoughts.(Edit: I guess that's why they call it brain"storming"- get it?) I don't know if I would always call them ideas. Sometimes they are questions, sometimes they are better understandings, sometimes reinforcements or connections, and sometimes they are brand new ideas- which can be very bad or very good (or silly or morbid or strange or stupid or any other number of adjectives- they are just ideas of any form.) Most of my thoughts are in images. It can be like those dreams stereotypical in cartoons and TV shows, a bunch of nonsensical images floating in spirals in my mind- (actually, that is a good example of an "image" that I was unable to turn into solid words so I just described the image instead.) And that's what happens when I'm processing things. and when it's moving really fast hopefully I can pick a thought line and slow it down and break it down a bit. (Not always) and in the worst versions of these sessions, I'm back to nothing or square one. In the best ones, I come up with good solid connections, understandings, and things that I've never thought about before.
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  4. #24
    I drink your milkshake. Thessaly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    First, state whether you use Ni or Ne (doesn't have to be dominant or auxiliary). How do you come up with ideas? What do you think of brainstorming?
    Brainstorming is a bit more of an extroverted function so it's not really something I benefit terribly from.

    I'm an Ne user. My ideas come from anywhere and everywhere. I am constantly in creative mode. I'm just constantly linking unrelated things/thoughts/words/concepts.

    For example, I think of the architecture of clothing or the philosophy of art. I'll warp a concept in mind entirely so that it's an oxymoron when I'm done with it. I just in general really enjoy the perversion of every day language. My brain is an Eskimo. I'd like to kiss you with my skin. Tomorrow is yesterday. I'd like to tra la la la in the who ha hee with your ob lob og. Making all those abstract connections that don't formally exist and creating novel scenarios in your head.

    The more experiences/knowledge you have in life, the more you can twist those elements into something new. It's really just linking different things in interesting ways. A foot walking around in a shoe isn't very novel, but eating a foot out of a shoe (like a bowl) is strange and unusual.
    With dreamers, pure and simple, the imagination remains a vaguely sketched inner affair. It is not embodied in any aesthetic or practical invention. Reverie is the equivalent of weak desires. Dreamers are the aboulics of the creative imagination.

  5. #25
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
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    I brainstorm like a mofo. I don't really understand how people see their Ne or Ni or whatever. I guess I'm too close to it. Mostly I just think of things that remind me of whatever things I'm thinking of. Then sometimes I apply principals that apply to that 'other thing' to the 'thing I am thinking of' to see if I can scare something novel up. Sometimes I pare ideas down to their bones, sometimes I tweak them to see when they are no longer themselves. I guess none of this makes much sense.

  6. #26
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    I want to scream "YES!" to so many posts here I don't know where to start
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  7. #27
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    well...umm...I guess I shouldn't expect that anyone sees it the way I do or understand why I understand the functions the way I do. But I think it's worth saying my peace about this:

    Ni is introverted, so you aren't engaging reality when using it. It closes you off from reality in an attempt to narrow it down in some fashion with a metaphor or insight or symbolism of thought or whatever you want to call it. It's like a philosophical involution.

    Ne is extroverted, so you are engaging reality when using it. But you aren't engaging it directly. It comes off as expressing new possibilities in an effort to see them manifest; but they are more like suggestions or possibilities removed from reality that could change it (hence not engaging reality directly).

    That's closer to Jung.

    MBTI seems to invert the way it looks at a type. For example, someone who uses Ni+Te in the Jungian sense might be typed Ti+Ne in MBTI. The reason seems to be that an Ni+Te type when extroverting will have a closer psychological understanding/utilization of Ne over Te because intuition is the most preferred; and their ability to use Jungian Ni with thinking in order to synthesize and deconstruct how certain ideas of thought or rationale play out in reality is seen as Ti. But it's a different Ti, one that doesn't really like or want to judge people impersonally, but is used as a tool to understand things and constantly question and re-evaluate their own conclusions, one that seeks to categorize the world symbolically and not typically seek ways to judge your actions. Jung's Ti requires that one judges other people impersonally in some manner.

    I know this sounds like the J/P thing in socionics, but that's kind of a coincidence; the way socionics is applied apart from Jung is really intellectually dishonest/biased and thus stupid, imo.

    A lot of people don't care about typology as much as I seem to, so I don't think anyone particularly cares what details I have here and probably the majority of members here think typology is just a lesson in bias, and a pseudo-science. Point being, it's a good idea to understand how someone is looking at this so you don't get confused, imo.

    Maybe I just wasted 10 minutes of my life writing this for people that don't actually care what I think or think it's crazy to bother, but what the hell. That's my honest transient assessment at the moment.

  8. #28
    Tier 1 Member LunaLuminosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RevlisZero View Post
    First, state whether you use Ni or Ne (doesn't have to be dominant or auxiliary).
    Ne, I think. (That part is obligatory )

    How do you come up with ideas?
    How do I not come up with them? And I don't mean that in the sense that idea-generation never turns off but that it just happens in so many ways. I do have a lot of blank states where nothing at all comes to me. Sometimes one thing sort of cooks up and weaves itself inside of me and it is solid enough that I know it's a strong answer. A lot of times all sorts of things will just come up in some chaotic sort of chain and fly away and I have to try to catch them in a net to get them to work together and be expressable. A lot of times I go through seas of research and experiences with a net for those that inspire something. Sometimes I can go in my own head and find something spring enough to jump from. The only rule to ideas is there are no rules The new and shiny helps though... (that, and actually feeling 'well')

    What do you think of brainstorming?
    Very helpful if I have someone actually willing to play idea-catch with me. Paper is a nice substitute for the majority of the time that that is not available. Sometimes it will trigger one of those blank states though and the flow is better when I've tricked myself into focusing on something else and of course at that point my mind is willing to venture elsewhere In group settings it is something I can get kind of serious about, not that the session should be serious because it really has to be the opposite , but that since it's important it bothers me if things spiral into addressing the people in the group on a personal level or talking about what they are going to do later that week without any intention of using such sidetracking to make the session/project more awesome.

    When I come up with a creative solution or idea, I usually wouldn't be able to explain how I came up with it. I just think about it and an idea comes to me. If I like the idea, I might go with that, unless I think I can come up with something better, then I'll keep thinking. I'm not really trying to grasp at many different possibilities and then evaluate them later, it's more like I'm diving into a sea of ideas, searching for the one perfect idea, and when I find it I'll just know that's the one. Though it's not often that I actually find "the one". I usually end up settling for an idea that's good enough, though not really what I'd been searching for.
    I can relate to this somewhat. "Diving into the sea" is one of many appropriate analogies I have used... it could be a different sort of sea you are talking about here though.

    I've never really liked brainstorming. To me it just doesn't seem necessary, because if I focus on the kind of idea I'm looking for, I can come up with something creative. I don't really need to make a list of possible ideas, because all I need is one good one. I also don't like writing down every idea I come up with because I like to filter it out right away and only keep it in mind if it's one of the best ideas.
    This seems like it could be a I/E thing in general, rather than Ne/Ni, if it's just that you like to do all the filtering in your head.


    I'm starting to get a little tired here so as a shortcut I'll say pretty much all that @mmhmm said applies, especially the part about mutant idea babies

  9. #29
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    I have dominant Ne and I love brainstorming. I come up with new ideas of doing things etc. very often. Brainstorming is very natural for me. I'm also good in combining "old" things to "new things". This brainstroming of mine concentrates more on thoughts/ideas than on actualy physical world. I mean, I'm creative but not creative as a artist who does something with his/her hands. I'm more creative in idea/thought-level. And I'm good in promoting my ideas ot other people but I'm also willing to change a view-point if somebody has good enough idea in my opinion. And I'm always able/willing to come up with better ideas. I get inspired with brainstorming but my interest in the ideas that I come up with isn't that long lasting... So, I have short attention spam also. But the ideas that really inspire me, I am able to make them happen. Because even if I have ideas of things that aren't realistically able to make happen (what if-kind of things), most of my ideas can be implemented to real life. I am also good in organizing people to make things happen, and it's sometimes better than other people implement and test my ideas.

  10. #30
    You have a choice! 21%'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Interesting. You made me consider this a bit deeper. I see you do not brainstorm. It looks like you use a form of deduction to understand an issue/problem...Then you just wait for a solution to appear? That seems very Ni. But not so much Ti, as Ti is all about finding a solution, and making something work. But maybe as tert Ti, Ti is more just about deduction and understanding and not so much about finding a solution?

    ...

    So, you made me consider I really do use deductive methods (Ti?) to understand something/someone, but then I also use induction to put it all back together, which I think is Ni at work (with Fe/Te?). So it's like a V^ (mountain) of breaking down, putting back together. But mostly I lean toward inductive reasoning, which I perceive is due to my dom Ni.
    It's hard for me to differentiate between Ni and Ti. I know Ni is supposed to be about the perspective -- like where you are looking from, and Ni is supposed to be like running around a thing trying to get a look from all angles to decide what it is, but there's gotta be Fe and Ti at work there somewhere.

    When I look at an INTJ's Ni+Te and compare it to my own thought processes, I find Ni+Te extremely structured and rather rigid. I can relate a lot of why Ni+Te would come up with a certain train of thought -- but I wouldn't go down that path myself. It's like a piece of information that Te considers important is not considered as important by Fe, or Ti, even in logical reasoning.

    Ti doms jump too quickly to solution's oriented thinking for me, have you noticed that as well? Not thorough enough. My Ti is definitely slave to my N.
    I feel like Ti doms jump to all kinds of conclusions very quickly, but can afterwards change their mind just as quickly
    Ti also feels very broad, for some reason. Te cares about the details. Ti doesn't. That's just my impression anyway (with nothing to back it up, unfortunately)


    Overall, I am a VERY slow thinker, but I'd say very thorough. (when it's a 'subject' I like).
    Me too! It takes ages for me to 'settle' on an opinion. But once I have an opinion, it's pretty hard to change it.
    4w5 sp/sx EII

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